I will do it this time

This topic contains 188 replies, has 23 voices, and was last updated by  fatrabbit 3 years, 8 months ago.

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  • Hi @poggy-vegan I am a vegan too! Well thankfully I do not have a lot to lose but its stubborn! 10 would be good but even better would be 15 lbs
    Its been stuck there for some time but I did lose 6 lbs the time I did the Fast Diet ( gained back since ) ! But at the time, it was so effortless, really. And I felt good eating less those 2 days. I don’t know why I stopped! But hey, now is now and thank you for the support!
    Awwwww your baggy trousers! Maybe you can get them altered soon! Lucky you!

    Tell me a little about your typical fast days, what time frames do you use, what do you eat/ drink? Thanks!

    poggy-vegan I’m glad you liked the chick pea cheese idea. I was really pleased when I came up with that as I generally dislike vegan foods that are imitating non vegan food. Processed food is rubbish whether it is vegan or non vegan. Although I am grateful that my son eats vegan sausages as opposed to the real thing. It is a lot of work running a sanctuary but I have been doing it for over ten years now and have a really good system and good volunteers who come and help. We have a lot of really old animals but they are happy. I can’t think of anything else I would rather do. And I can slop around in baggy trousers (most of mine would be falling down if they didn’t have draw strings) without anyone giving me disapproving looks.

    Opal shine I had house rabbits for a while but they were so destructive! They ate cables, wallpaper, skirting boards, vinyl flooring, books, bedclothes and one even chewed the pipe on the back of the toilet and flooded downstairs. All the rabbits live outside now and they are much happier and healthier.

    On a fast day I eat all my 500 calories in one meal in the late afternoon or early evening. During the morning I drink black coffee and then switch to herbal teas my favourites being peppermint, fennel and cinnamon. If I’m struggling I have a cup of hot marmite which is about 1/2 a teaspoon dissolved in hot water. If I’m desperate I put a few bits of dried seaweed in that as a sort of imitation miso soup only cheaper. It is really important to drink enough and I find the hot drinks better at quelling hunger. The marmite also helps by providing extra salt which you need to compensate for what you aren’t eating. My favourite fast day meal is a carton of organic kidney beans mashed with a couple of chilis and some chili powder with a little cheese crumbled on top (I’m vegetarian not vegan) with some sugarsnap peas or sweet corn on top heated in the microwave and then topped off with salad leaves.This is very satisfying and provides lots of nutrients. Or I have a bowl of whatever I cooked the night before, typically a vegan curry or chili. If I were to split the 500 into several meals I would just be hungry and miserable the whole time. I like to feel full at least once a day. The fast really starts after dinner the night before and finishes after noon the next day as I tend to do 18/6 on NFDs so 40ish hours, every other day. I have a lot of weight to lose so I want to be really focused on this and see results as quickly as possible. I think I have lost a couple of stone already.

    Hello opal-shine, yes tell me about stubborn fat! I gain so easily and quickly and the fat likes to stick around. I think I eat less than the averidge person, it’s just hot fair, haha.
    On fast days I skip breakfast (on many other days too since I started If) My lunch on FD is very similar each time, I eat algae noodles or conjack noodles that are very low calories, with a tomatoe sauce with mushrooms,both do not add many calories,creamed up with a blend of silken tofu and bell pepper and a big salad with a nonfat blended dressing, for example sauerkraut, gerkin, cucumber, bell pepper or suchlike with a bit of silken tofu. I manage to make a big meal out of it with just 250 cal.Sometimes I add some boiled veg like cabbage or brokkoli if I have a calorie allowence. This is really filling, but of course it does not last long because it’s only 250 cal after all.
    When I get home I am ravenous and I make a quick porridge of 1 tablespoon of flax and 1 of chia seeds, 2 spoons of protein powder,half an apple cut fine. I add hot water and top with some soya yogourt. That is quite filling again for 250 cal and very tasty and satisfying. My protein powder makes it yummy.By the time I get hungry again it’s time for bed. I do this twice a week and it is a routine I can live with.Because I know exactly what I eat I find it easy to stick with it. I have no struggles with temptation to eat other stuff. My difficulty are the other days, where I have to hold back not to eat too much and gain the lost weight back, like happened last week – sigh.

    usually about the first 10% of weight you lose is the easiest and mostly through catabolism (fancy way of saying muscle and the water trapped in muscle). I went from 238 to 219 without even noticing or putting in any effort. Then the fight started, it stayed on for almost 3 months, then it almost started flying off.
    This applied to me, though I found it only much after –


    Early in fasting weight loss is rapid, averaging 0.9 kg per day during the first week and slowing to 0.3 kg per day by the third week; early rapid weight loss is primarily due to negative sodium balance. Metabolically, early fasting is characterized by a high rate of gluconeogenesis with amino acids as the primary substrates. As fasting continues, progressive ketosis develops due to the mobilization and oxidation of fatty acids. As ketone levels rise they replace glucose as the primary energy source in the central nervous system, thereby decreasing the need for gluconeogenesis and sparing protein catabolism.

    I don’t know about rapid, cos I wasn’t fasting. I was just not eating rice and beans and bread and tortillas etc. But it did drop with no effort. Then I started the real struggle.


    Hi fatrabbit,yes, that chickpea bake was real good. We have also been experimenting with making various cheesy stuff with good results. Of course it is never really cheese…I have a couple of recipe books to work from, but I have little time, I have to wait until I retire next year.
    Must be lovely to be around so many animals. We have two cats and they are a joy.We have so much fun with them. Just now my hubby told me the story how he banged his gong and chanted OM as he does very early every morning and our cat Merlin responded by howling in the hallway. The two of them were taking it in terns, how sweet is that? 😊

    That must have been hilarious, the cat shouting back:) We have a talking husky who says helloooo and I love you and shouts at people. But he never barks. He also almost has his own fan club as he spends lots of time lying on my sisters bed half hanging out of the window at the front of the house. We always hear people stopping to talk to him. He lies there on a cushion with his front feet sticking out and his head hanging down. He opens the window himself even in the winter and freezes the house but he likes the cold. We don’t have cats because I am alergic to them. Not to other animals, just cats. I have no idea why. We had a rabbit we called Merlin. He was found straying in a multi story carpark and was brought to us by the security guard. He was in a really bad state and was never very healthy but he had a good couple of years here with lots of room to play and a lady rabbit to keep him company Daisy I think. Animals are very rewarding to be around. They are all such individuals, right from the smallest on up.

    Srinath, the study in the link refers to prolonged water fasting, right? So rather different than the modified ADF I am doing or the 5/2. I actually don’t think I lost weight very fast at first. But I did lose inches particularly from my waist. As I didn’t have functioning scales when I started my initial data is a bit vague. It is now a month since I got a battery for the scales and in that month I have gone from 230 down to 212lbs. So my weight loss is still going strong after three and a half months it can’t all be water. I fast for about 20 hours then eat the 500 calories then fast for about another 20 hours. Then eat two meals in about a six hour window and repeat. I think I am going into ketosis for at least a few of those hours. My understanding of the science is that muscle is unlikely to be catabolised unless you go into starvation mode by eating too few calories everyday. So I am careful to keep eating to TDEE on NFDs. I have cut out sugar and complex carbs except for occasional pasta meals which I justify to myself by the fact that leptin is produced more abundantly when you eat carbs but handled better when you eat few of them so alternating a bit seems logical. I eat lots of beans and veg and some cheese ad use either olive oil or coconut oil for cooking where I am quite generous with them because of the new research indicating that they are not the culprit in the obesity epidemic. I don’t eat snacks at all as I don’t want any extra insulin spikes. Also because I find it easier to not start than to stop.

    Fatrabbit :- I have not done much research like you have to what may be your WOE. But I found it easy to go into longer term fasting via the OMAD (one meal a day) plan.

    Anyway you went from 425 to 212 ? of which 18 lb went in a month – you easily have hit the right balance of food vs fast.

    I am not losing much and I am after that last shred of visceral fat (which is the hardest to get rid of). So I am going to get to 135 or wherever I am left when I start munching on visceral fat.


    Sorry I don’t know where that 425 came from – I have a pair of smashed finger in my left hand and I think I mistyped 225 (I think 100 kg is 225)

    I mistype things all the time because my fingers are bent out of shape from arthritis. But at least since I started fasting they don’t hyrt anymore. It was from 230 to 212, only today it has gone back up by 3lbs. 2lbs extra were there this morning and another 1lb went on during the day despite my fasting. That one has to be just water because I only drank coffee and mint tea. I counted my chickens before they hatched obviously:(

    I know there are good benefits from fasting for longer but I don’t particularly want to do it as this way I can live with but if it were to get more difficult I think I would risk giving up and there is too much at stake. One meal a day every other day is as far as I want to go. I like food and the prospect of none is too dreary to contemplate. I find that the fact that this way I really appreciate everything I eat gives it an extra boost and makes it more likely that I will stick with it. Everything I eat now feels like a treat. Lucky me:)

    Hi fatrabbit, that must have been so annoying to see the weight go up despite fasting. Same happen to me this week. I weigh myself every day, and the pound I lost after the fast day went back up after the 2 following days. But I know I did eat too much on one of those days, so it wasn’t a mystery. That is the advantage of weighing in every day, I know exactly what’s happening and how certain foods affect me.
    I agree with you, I will definitely not do any longer fasts either. I do not want my metabolism to crash, but I thought I might do a b2b. I fasted today and will do another one tomorrow. Hope to get back below 60kg that way.
    It was the first warm day today in Germany, felt like spring. Have you had some warm weather in UK too?

    I suppose it must form a pattern when you do it everyday and recognise what is going on but I get a bit too tied up in in it so I think I’ll look at it less frequently. I knew it might happen but was on a bit of a high from the good numbers…

    We had some nice warm days earlier in the week but today has been stormy with gusts of over 60mph and became rather exciting as a large tree blew over and narrowly missed a row of rabbit hutches. It has wrecked the fences on their runs and damaged a couple of fruit trees too. I had to rescue two of them in the middle of all the wind as the tree was threatening to settle and entirely block access to it. The remaining trees were thrashing about wildly and it was rather scary. But did they cooperate in their rescue? Of course not. Rabbits are not cooperative creatures. They made me chase them from one level to the other and open every door before I cornered them and then they wriggled like mad all the way to the barn. They weren’t very impressed about being dumped into a stable full of plastic bags either as it had been being used for storage. But I got it all nicely bedded and they calmed down. Later I had to move another pair too and discovered the tarp on the feed shed roof is shredded from the wind. There is rather a lot of work to do to fix all the damage but at least none of the animals were hurt. I just hope we can get them their runs back soon as I hate locking them inside.

    The fallen tree courtesy of storm Doris: http://imgur.com/a/6RY0e

    That’s terrible news, fatrabbit.The poor things did not know what befell them. And you have a lot of work to put it all right again.
    Our weather seems to follow yours, today the storm is over Germany.I hope it will not be as bad as with you.
    It looks like I have reached the dreaded platform. I only lost 200g after the fasting day yesterday.I wonder why these platforms happen. Is it the metabolism that simply gets used to make do with less food? I am doing another fast today and hope to have some better result tomorrow.

    Luckily none of the fence posts were broken. One of the other sanctuary trustees brought her chain saw and we got the tree clear of the fence so the wire could go back up and so the rabbits have their runs back already which they are very happy about. I don’t know what I would do without C and her ability to fix things. I am not much use with tools.

    I hope the storm isn’t as bad over there. We have had a beautiful day today, maybe you’ll have it tomorrow.

    200g is just a blip. Don’t worry it will go away again especially with you fasting again tomorrow.

    I managed to make rather a pig of myself yesterday. Nearly made myself sick. I was so close to not being able to keep it down. But actually that means my stomach must have shrunk considerably because I wouldn’t have struggled previously. And I doubt I actually went over TDEE, I just ate too much at once, so no harm done and hopefully a lesson learned. I need to be extra careful on NFD Saturdays when it us difficult to get away to sit down to eat properly because of volunteers and visitors. I tried to hang on by eating a big chunk of cheese and ended up not being able to wait for dinner and eating out of the pan instead.

    I don’t think I’m losing this week but I am not going to check until Wednesday. Confirming it won’t do me any good, and actually even if I’m wrong and I have it won’t be helpful either as it will only set me up for disappointment if it then goes the other way again. I am a bit too fond of competitions to cope with the set backs easily. I need to remember that for me not gaining weight is a win all by itself and see actual weight loss as a bonus as well as already having all the other wonderful benefits of fasting – the reduced pain, the clearer thinking, the increased energy. The scales really don’t matter that much, I am already winning. And I am now wearing my second pair of purple trousers that are a size smaller and didn’t fit even when I bought them:) I was nervous about trying them on in case I got depressed if it was a failure but they are the right size now:) It is a pity I don’t have any more clothes to grow down into but it has been too long since I was smaller than this. And I hate shopping so it won’t be a reward to have to buy new ones. I will use the draw strings to hold my trousers up for as long as possible.


    I just wanted to check in and see how everyone was doing. I saw the pics that @fatrabbit posted after the storm. I also love hearing stories about your animals and how much love and patience you show them.

    I hope you all are doing well. : )I am in really good spirits and remembering how much love and goodness is in my life. No matter what is happening outside of myself and no matter what conditions I encounter. Knowing I can flow down the river of life effortlessly if I let go does actually keeps me flowing down the river of life effortlessly contentedly.

    Coming from this place of remembrance keeps me on track with everything else. Even when it comes down to nourishing my body. I am more at peace and this peace in mind and emotions translates to allowing my body to make the adjustments it needs to.

    I should think that loving animals is a great reminder of how life is precious and wonderful and innocent.

    I look forward to my fasts to recalibrate my body, mind and soul!

    I will have my FD tomorrow, Monday, and have been trying my best to stick with the TDEE, but its only been a week. I am getting my sea legs. Vowing to go to the gym today even if for only 20 mins, I want to get back to some work with the weights. Good luck everyone!

    You were right ,fatrabbit, I did loose another 300g after the second fast day. So that made it a pound after the two days. I have been more careful on my NFdays not to gain too much back.Tomorrow is the next fast day.

    I found another food item that I really like on my fast days, and it is blended cauliflower with some silken tofu and lemon and pepper. If you can’t get silken tofu, it also works without, or with some soya yogourt. When you blend the cauliflower, it looks and (almost)tasts like mashed potatoe. It is very low calorie and very satisfying.

    Well done fitting into your purple trouthers. My trouthers are loose and I fit into ones I had put aside as too tight.Actually I have stacks of trouthers that are too tight for me. I only need to buy new ones when I reach my target weight because I have not seen that for 30 years. I am excited at the prospect of actually getting there. It’s about 8kg to go.

    The storm was not too bad in our area. We had one really warm day, just like spring, but it is cooler now again. There are still bits of snow on the fields, meeting slowly. We live at 800 m up, so it’s always a bit cooler which is great in the hight of summer.
    How about your garden, fatrabbit, are you growing some vegetables this year? I hope your pains are not too bad.

    Glad to hear that you are feeling peaceful ADF12kgless. Our mental state is the determiner for what we make of life. Happiness is not so much about what happens to you but by what you make of it. I am hoping that I have finally got a better perspective on life. We humans really know how to torture ourselves. There is much to learn from animals and much to gain from being around them. They have been my therapy for a nunber of years now. We help each other.

    And I’m glad your upwards blip went away Poggy Vegan. These smaller movements are not really significant. It is the trend that counts. I have been cooking more cauliflower lately too. I just learned hiw healthy it is. I had no idea it contained complete protein. I always assumed it was a bit of a nutritional non entity mainly because it is so colourless I suppose. Yesterday I stir fried it with samphire and chilis and coconut. Although the show got stolen by the potatoes I cooked with chillies and parsnips and kale with mustard, flax and chia seeds. That was far too delicious! I am not very impressed with samphire. I will use something nicer with the cauliflower next time.

    I doubt I’ll grow much veg this year. Our garden is too shady for it to grow very well. We are on the east side of a ridge and have tall trees or buildings on every side. There is too much traffic to grow anything out at the front where there is sun. Nowhere at the back gets more than an hour or two of sun even in the summer. Which is good in that it means I don’t have to worry about the animals overheating in the rare event that it actually gets hot. I have tried putting veg in pots in the past and using a piece of adjacent land as an allotment but the watering of the pots is too time consuming and the neighbours by the allotment plot are too obnoxious. They complain about everything, especially any visitors we get, and I don’t want to deal with them. Instead I’ll concentrate on getting woodland flowers and climbers growing around the animal enclosures and on the fences. The snowdrops look lovely at the moment, and the helebores and the primroses are starting to flower. I put in lots of soft fruit a few years ago as that grows in part shade. I should have the energy to pick it this year. The birds got most of it last year.

    Opal shine the first couple of weeks are the hardest. You will be in the flow of it soon. I hope you find it suits you.

    Fatrabbit, I had never heard of samphire, I had to Google it.Also I had not known that cauliflower has a full protein. I have also not eaten cauli much because the taste is a bit limp, but I really like it mashed.
    You sound like a great cook, your recipes sound delicious.
    I am a bit tired of my fast day meal, so I worked out a new one for Thursday. I will have kale, which I found in my deep freeze. (I had 80 kale plants last year,it was a bit of a mistake, because previously the slugs had eaten all my little kale plants and I was determined to have some, so I grew loads in the greenhouse and planted them all, but the slugs never came and I ended up with 80 big healthy kale plants. It was a joke for a long while.)
    So, kale and mashed cauliflower with silken tofu made into a creamy sauce with algae noodles and two soya saussages and salad. Should be nice.
    I have been down to 59.6kg today and was really pleased, but I think I might have blown it today because I got so starving before lunch, I grabbed some roasted peanuts which are very high calorie, but boy, it was worth it in that moment. I just hope the scales are not going to punish me too much tomorrow.
    It snowed heavy all day and we lost all the open patches in the fields. The cats are very disappointed and have gone back to bed.But the snow will
    not last, it will melt quickly, or so I hope.

    Poggy Vegan well done getting under 60kg:)) Even if it drifts upnagain temporarily it will soon become fixed. I find Inhave to hit each weight twice before it is permanent and Incan count it properly. And afew peanuts won’t have made much difference longbterm. Your talking about all those kale plants has me wanting to try and use the allotment despite the horrible neighbours. I shouldn’t let them upset me so much. If I successfully grew eighty kale plants there would be no difficulty getting it all eaten. Kale is one of my favourites and the rabbits are particularly partial to it too. Samphire is not worth paying for in my opinion. We got it free from the veg man and I was not impressed, so you weren’t missing much. I love cooking, I like combining things and trying new versions. I envy you that snow a bit. The rabbits, unlike your cats, love snow. It has such good digging potential. It is lovely to watch them play in it. They do lots of skipping about and dancing like young lambs as well as frantic digging. There was sleet here yesterday and I got soaked and really chilled. It took me ages to warm up again even pressed against the radiator. Snow is drier and less unpleasant to work in. Today is much nicer with some sunshine. It makes such a difference. I had to move a pair of old rabbits from their multi level hutch as they suddenly developed cataracts and were getting really wary of jumping down to go out in the run. In order to give them a single level hutch I had to move five other pairs as well to make sure everybun’s accomodation suited the occupants. They are all out there happily exploring and meeting their new neighbours. They are such curious creatures. The oldies with the cataracts are getting around much better in the single level hutch and didn’t hesitate to fully explore the run as well. Rabbits cope really well with going blind as long as their living space is suitable. After all it is dark underground and they navigate their burrows with no trouble. They seem to have very good spacial awareness and mapping skills.

    I weighed both yesterday morning and this morning as it was the end of the feb challenge yesterday. I ended that month down by ten pounds at 212lbs, and I started March at 94.9kg as I found the switch on the scales finally and somehow lost nearly 3lbs overnight. I have also finally lost more inches on the main measurements. They had been firmly stuck despite the loss in weight although it was clearly going from my arms and legs and I now have discernable hip bones again. My waist measurement is now 36 inches. I would really like to get it down to 34 soon where it will be half my height and a better health indicator.

    Today I actually forgot it isn’t a fast day and didn’t remember to eat until 2pm and then had a very healthy salad with some cheese to boost the calories. Dinner will be a sweet potato curry as I wheedled out of making the pancakes I had promised my mum and son. I bought her a big bag of nuts and a bag of dried apricots to make up for it. And she does love the sweet potato curry anyway. Son took the remains of the brie as compensation. He doesn’t need a pile of carbs any more than I do. At least I am setting him a good example now. If I can lose weight so can he.

    Well done, fatrabbit, that is such brilliant news. It must feel great to be so successful. Loosing weight and inches is the ultimate, isn’t it?
    I am still struggeling to get well below 60kg. I had a good fast day today eating salad, kale, mashed cauliflower, algae noodles in a creamy silken tofu sauce and two vegan saussages. I was ravenously hungry all morning, so really enjoyed this satisfying lunch of hardly over 250 kcal. I loved the salad sauce of sauerkraut, gerkin, cucumber,spring onion and a little silken tofu.
    Good you inspire your nearest and dearest. My hubby does IF too, but simply for health reasons. He is thin as a stick and an eat what he likes, never gets fat. Envy envy…

    Thanks Poggy Vegan, I am pleased with my progress:)) It comes off faster when one is bigger. Your percentage losses probably aren’t much different to mine. I would be finished if I was 60kg. My best case final scenario goal is 63.5kg which would be the weight I was when I was 23 and fitting in some really small clothes. But I might settle for reaching a healthy BMI. I’ll see when the time comes.

    I’m feeling absolutely rubbish today. I think I pulled a muscle doing the imaginary hula hooping for the March challenge. My shoulder feels like it is on fire and my neck is tense and has given me a spliting head ache. I haven’t hurt this much since I started fasting. I still managed to get the sheds cleaned out as I am well practised in ignoring pain but it took a long time. I am trying to look on the bright side of it that I no longer feel like this every day, the way I did last year. And at least it isn’t making me want to eat. I ate nothing until the animals were put away, and that was after six as it was a lovely bright day, and then had a small amount of leftover sweet potato curry with salad leaves, beetroot and peppers. I am feeling very full and even bloated. I think my hormones may be acting up. My pain is often worse at that time of the month. My knuckles are more swollen too and I am getting knobbles on new fingers:(( I had hoped the fasting would stop the arthritis progressing but clearly it hasn’t. But I still have more use of my index finger than I did four months ago so that is something. It looks like rain all day tomorrow which means I have far less work to do so hopefully the rest will help my shoulder. And I won’t be trying any more imaginary hula hooping!

    I just realised that I have been measuring my hips in the wrong place. I was going for the biggest measurement which was encompassing my belly instead of the widest which doesn’t. It is still a big number but not quite as bad and matches my waist measurement better. 36 and 46 seems less bad than 36 and 48. 10 inches to go on each to reach goal…not sure if that is realistic but no harm in trying. my chest is disappearing faster and is down to 44 but I am usually a bit pear shaped. I have been wondering what a good goal is for the neck measurement and found a site that quotes 13.4 inches as the border between healthy/unhealthy. Apparently neck measurement is another good health indicator, along with the waist to height ratio and the waist to hip one, many saying that various of these are better indicators than BMI. My neck measurement is currently 13.5 so not far to go on that one. Waist to height stands at 0.53 which is close to ok (should be at or under 0.5) and waist to hip at 0.78 which is already in a good place (should be at or under 0.8 for women).

    Weight this morning is the same as it was on Weds morning (209lbs – I am going back to lbs as calling a measurement in kg weight disturbs the physicist in me) despite doing everything right. However I am learning that I need to hit every low twice before it really sticks. I am confident that my weight on Weds will be lower. The tracker is showing quite a consistent pattern for my weight with a steady gradient but regular sideways steps too. If you turn off the neck and goal lines you get a better view. I like numbers and graphs:) I don’t often get to indulge my mathematical side.

    Now four months in to this way of eating and I appear to have stalled. I am the same weight today as on the 21st of feb. Although my measurements have gone down by a few inches. Hormones may be to blame. I don’t seem to be going to have a period this month. Nevertheless I will persevere…

    My resolve is getting well and truely tested. I seem to be stuck at the weight I first reached on Feb 21st. 3 weeks of fasting for no gain, and they have been more difficult too. I am sure it because of the extra stress that I have been experiencing and because menopause is playing havoc with my hormones. Yesterday I just had to eat early. I kept it to a healthy mealnand attempted to make that the only one but the evening dragged on too long and I ended up eating again. That was the first fast day I have missed since I started fasting every other day in November. I am fighting not to just throw my hands up and give up. I tend to be very all or nothing, but this is too important. It doesn’t help that I crammed in an extra days work on Saturday and now my hip is really hurting so even walking is difficult. My pain levels are heading back towards pre fasting levels, no doubt another effect of the stress and hormones. I would like to go outside and do some gardening in the beautiful sunshine but I dare not risk not being able to get the work done tomorrow as I am down a very important team member and have to do it myself however I feel. So I am faced with a quiet day resting and trying not to eat in order to rescue the situation and get back into a pattern. Thank goodness for my languages. I am getting fonder and fonder of Dutch. I bought a Dutch series on Amazon video and will see how much I can understand without reading the subtitles.

    Dear fatrabbit, sorry to hear you are having a tough time of late. But at the beginning of March you had gone nicely down below 100kg. Did weight creap up again? It must be so annoying to struggle with health problems as well. I really feel for you and I hope you find the strength to carry on. These platos are such a nuicance, but if you carry on the weight can do nothing but go down eventually.
    I have been a bit quiet because I had a few very stressful days as well. My car died on me, 6 weeks before planned, and I suddenly had to get a new car. I had to go by bus to work, which is a real pain, and it was a whole saga before I am mobile again now.
    I lost great weight while I was stressed and not very hungry but I blew it again when I had a big pack of crisps out of sheer frustration. Still, I remained below 60kg, my watershed. I am down to 58.8kg and had a really good fasting day today, so I am hoping for another loss. I am looking forward to reach 52kg, that was my weight when I was in my twenties. I am a bit shorter than you I think.
    Wishing you all the best, fatrabbit, stay strong and the scales will show lower numbers in due course.

    Hello fatrabbit, I wrote a whole lot but it does not appear. Ah ok, it worked now.
    Dear fatrabbit, sorry to hear you are having a tough time of late. But at the beginning of March you had gone nicely down below 100kg. Did weight creap up again? It must be so annoying to struggle with health problems as well. I really feel for you and I hope you find the strength to carry on. These platos are such a nuicance, but if you carry on the weight can do nothing but go down eventually.
    I have been a bit quiet because I had a few very stressful days as well. My car died on me, 6 weeks before planned, and I suddenly had to get a new car. I had to go by bus to work, which is a real pain, and it was a whole saga before I am mobile again now.
    I lost great weight while I was stressed and not very hungry but I blew it again when I had a big pack of crisps out of sheer frustration. Still, I remained below 60kg, my watershed. I am down to 58.8kg and had a really good fasting day today, so I am hoping for another loss. I am looking forward to reach 52kg, that was my weight when I was in my twenties. I am a bit shorter than you I think.
    Wishing you all the best, fatrabbit, stay strong and the scales will show lower numbers in due course.

    Hi Poggy Vegan,
    I am still below 100kg, around 95kg I think, but it had gone as far down as 94kg and bounced back. Since I had done everything to plan this is very disappointing. But having seen other people get stuck I know it happens. I will try and continue without the scales. I have bought pairs of trousers in smaller sizes to act as measures. The two purple pairs I was so pleased to fit into not long ago are now too big and I can get into a smaller size. And I can actually tighten my stomach muscles for the first time since my last pregnancy. My last child was a very big baby and really did for them. So I have positives to focus on instead of the scales.

    I am sorry to hear about your having stress too, but glad it hasn’t stopped your weight loss. You are getting ever closer to your goal. I used to find cars very stressful and am pleased not to own one anymore, but I don’t find buses easy either. At least as I work at home that doesn’t much matter especially these days when shopping can be done on the internet. I hope you get it sorted soon.

    Hi fatrabbit, I wonder how you are doing. How about those new trouthers, do they fit already?
    I have sorted out my transport woes now. Relying on the bus is really not an option where I live. My new car is much smaller than the one I got from my father all those years ago, but I don’t mind that, it will be cheaper and handy. Going a bit slower will be good for me too 🙂
    With the weight it gets ever more difficult.I feel like I am treading on the spot. I got down to 58,2kg, but from there the numbers go up and down, up and down. I have to hit every low twice, if not three times. Also cravings get stronger. I have not eaten bread for quite a while, especially wheat bread, but I must have some sandwich or vegan burger soon, I keep thinking about it.
    I am still doing ok on the fast days, but the other days I find it hard to hold myself back.
    We had lovely sunny weather all week while I was working, and now we got a weekend full of rain and wind. Not even the cats want to go out. You are lucky you work at home where you can go out any time when the weather is nice.
    Wishing you lean andhappy times.

    My weight doesn’t seem to be going anywhere. I am battling with myself to keep going, but thankfully seem to be winning at the moment. I messed up a couple of fast days and had to repeat them and only just squeaked through by accepting the new 800 calorie limit instead of 500 as a fast day allowing myself an extra salad the one day. It allowed me to be more positive and so has to be a good thing. It just felt too hard doing all those fasts and not losing any weight and being incredibly stressed as well. Now the stress has reduced I have been able to do a more normal fast day today with just one meal, although I may have been a bit generous with portion size. Still it was certainly under 800 and so acceptable. I always thought the 500 figure had been pulled out of thin air so I am not surprised that it has been increased. No research was done for other numbers. More emphasis is being put on the time spent not eating and what you eat now too, again not surprising. There is a thread about the new version if you haven’t seen it yet.

    I am staying away from the scales as much as I can. I will probably take a peek on the 21st as that will be a benchmark and on the 31st for the end of the March challenge. I got on much better before I started weighing with no dissatisfaction. I was happy with the other effects this way of eating has had. My increased energy, reduced pain, reduced anxiety (I was very stressed for a while but that used to be constant and only served to highlight the change) food tastes better, and of course there are the loose trousers. The next size down fit but are not yet comfortable enough to work in, but I will get there. The pace I was losing at before obviously was not sustainable. I will just have to be patient. And even if I stick on this plateau forever it would be better than going backwards.

    There is clearly more going on with this method than calorie reduction. If it was only about that I would still be dropping weight at the same pace as before as my calorie deficit has been just as high this month as last when I lost 10-18lbs depending on which dates I count between. Jan 21st – Feb 21st down 18lbs whereas Feb 21st – March 21st is in danger of being upwards despite my fasting just as well. Bodies are complex systems with too many variables to predict exactly what they will do! I can speculate endlessly about stress and menstrual hormones playing a role innthe plateau but the important thing is not to eat the way I used to. So I WILL stick with this. I WILL do it this time!

    I would be interested to read the thread about the new version. Where can I find it?
    Good to see your firm resolve despite the difficulties. You are such an inspiration, fatrabbit.

    refered to here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/12/good-news-dieters-52-relaxes-rules-allows-800-calories-day/

    and apparently there is a fuller update due out soon, that should be interesting…

    Thanks for that, it was an interesting read. I have been reasonably content with my two 250 kcal meals, but it’s good to know that there is room for a bit more.
    I have never counted some kcal of the rice milk in my tea, so I have already gone over 500 a bit.
    I think stress can seriously stall your weight loss. I guess if you have less stress now you might well come off your plateau in due course. But you are right, we can never go back to the way we used to eat, otherwise the weight will pile back on, that’s just logical. It does worry me to see myself gain weight immediately on the nonfastdays days. Of course I don’t know how my body would respond if I stopped fasting. Would the weight go up on and on or would it go up a bit and then stop, or at least slow down a lot? I guess I will find out when I reach my target. I’ll let you know what happens then.
    Greetings from the wetlands. ..

    here is the full story: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/you/article-4313396/On-5-2-lost-9-kilos-reversed-diabetes.html

    I was thinking about doing just 800 calories every day (the FAST 800 BSD) if the plateau sticks firm, but just thinking about it made me hungry and I let myself have a bowl of cereal. Not a particularly good omen! Hopefully my normalising hormones will let my current system start working again. But at least there is another option available if I need it. Fast is good but so is sustainability. Come on body let go of the weight before I have to take even more drastic measures!

    This person simcoeluv talks quite interesting about platoes. I just had a read about that.

    Wow, 800 kcal every day, that’s quite a plan. I am not sure about the metabolism thing. I know from previous experience that my body just gets used to make do with a low calorie diet if you know what I mean. That’s why I think the 5:2 worked so good for me, because it is tricking my body by using these short one day lack of calories without giving the body a chance to adjust. That way the body sees no need to drastically shut down metabolism.
    But you know your own body best and I think it is good to experiment. You could also weigh yourself before and after a fast day to find out if you actually loose on a fast day or not. Then you would know if your body really holds onto it’s weight, or if you gain on non fast days back what you lost, which is my situation. Then you would know where you can adjust to get a better result.

    I weighed yesterday and my weight has finally dropped again to 206lbs. It is such a relief not be stuck any more. I find fasting much harder when my belief that it will make me lose weight is wavering. I really want to continue to make fast progress so I amngoing to trial the BSD at 800 calories per day of Mediterranean style eating. I am already off the refined carbs anyway so no problem there, sans fish obviously. There is plenty of protein in pulses and cheese so no concerns over that. Flax seeds will contribute some of the good fatty acids. I think it will be good to eat two smaller meals rather than one big one so as not to fill myself up as much and so let my stomach shrink. I plan on sticking to a relatively short eating window though to get as much proper fasting in as possible. 20:4 would be good but I will have to see how sustainable that is. To some extent my work will dictate when I eat so I will need to be a bit flexible.

    I am not going to weigh very often. I don’t find seeing the fluctuations in intestinal contents and cell water content that close scrutiny of the scales reveals to be helpful. It bounces around too much with little correlation to actual fat loss, which is the bit I am interested in. Weighing less frequently will focus on that and save me unnecessary disappointment. I next plan on weighing on the 31st for the end of the March challenge. I doubt it is enough time to get under my original goal of getting under 200lbs by the end of the month unless the BSD really suits me and I can stick to it the whole way. Time will tell.

    My measurements are down too. My waist is just below 35inches, getting close to the magic half my height marker. BMI is approaching 30 too. My hips are down to 44, as is my bust. Some of my clothes are just ridiculously large now. Much more and not even the drawstrings will make them useable. Maybe I need to buy some braces? I now have to hold my pyjamas up while I walk to avoid embarrassing revelations. It may be time to start wearing the next size down trousers that were a bit uncomfortable when I tried them a couple of weeks ago.

    Glad to hear your good news, farabbit.The weight HAD to get moving eventually. I hope your new regime gives you good results.It’s so great when your trouthers get looser and looser, isn’t it?

    I red about an experiment where a group of people ingested the same amount of calories for weightloss, but one group ate in the evening and the other group did not. The group that did not eat in the evening lost more than the other group. In light of this I think it is a good plan to have two smaller meals.Perhaps that will keep you off the dreaded plato.

    I found an oat bran with germ, online actually, where I can eat 65g, made into a porridge, well I use 50g which is plenty with some salt and soya yogourt on the top.I find that super filling comfort food for a mere 250kcal.By the time I get hungry again it’s time for bed anyway. I originally got the bran to keep me regular and it works well for that too.

    Nonfastdays are still a struggle. I had two meetings this week with food involved and that’s always difficult, but I managed not to gain more than 200g which is great.However, no loss this week bur nevermind.

    I am sure the losses will be back soon Poggy Vegan. I am going to try not waiting until I am finished at night to eat as it is getting rather late as the days get longer. Last night it was eight before I finished and I had seen that research before. I need to strike a balance between eating earlier and dealing with cravings in the evenings. Also if I eat earlier I get hungrier so eating before 3pm is no good for me.

    I weighed again on Friday after the first 5 days of 800 and was down to 203. And my energy levels are back up. Over 3lbs in 3 days! Some of that has to have been a delayed loss from all that fasting done on the plateau, I can’t see that 3 days can really have that dramatic an effect. But I have decided to carry on with 800 calories of only healthy food (veg and pulses and a little cheese) until the end of the month and then reevaluate. I don’t need to commit to the full 8 week blood sugar diet unless I continue to find it easy and effective. My hunger seems to have retreated again and fasting until about 3 is quite easy, then I eat a little and have more a few hours later. I want to keep eating to a three or four hour eating window to keep the most actual fasting time possible. Water, black coffee and teas allowed of course in order to stay well hydrated, although I restrict coffee to the morning to help my sleep. Which has been much better with the 800 calories. It may be just coincidence, or it just might suit me well.

    Hi fatrabbit, that’s all such good news. I am happy for you to be so successful and loose 3 pound in one go. Good that your energy is up as well. Maybe the 800 kcal really suits you well. I think it is best to carry on with what works for you. That what counts, isn’t it?

    Last week was a little difficult for me, but I am glad to say I survived it without great gains. I am down to 58.2kg and I hit 57.9 once. And that’s despite one binge I have to confess. I make my own chocolate out of coconut oil, cocoa and roasted almonds. Then I made the mistake of eating some when I was very hungry, well, I could not stop then until I started to feel a bit queesy, haha. I learned from that to only have such a yummy treat after lunch, when I am not hungry anymore. That’s working fine now. I do like to have a treat sometimes, so timing is key for me.
    I had a good fast day today and hope to go below 57.9kg tomorrow.

    I have reached the 0.5 waist to height ratio that is supposed to be a better health marker than BMI which is good news. My waist has stayed at 34 inches for the past few days so it is not just a blip. And this morning my weight is 200.2lbs nearly, but not quite, at that next landmark. And BMI exactly 30. I am on the brink of no longer being obese but simply overweight:) It has taken nearly 5 months but been such a good thing. I am so pleased that I made that decision.

    I am going to continue the blood sugar diet until the 21st at least so a full month, then decide whether it is a good idea to continue it. I don’t want to impact my metabolism by doing it for too long, that is a big calorie deficit. But for now it remains really easy. Having already given up sugar and processed carbs and having practiced fasting on 500 calories hugely reduced the difficulty level. 800 still feels like a generous amount of food to me particularly in the short eating window that I have chosen to use. Especially since I am veggie and so can eat a decent volume of food. Protein simply isn’t a problem. Pulses and cheese have lots and I make a point of having a tiny amount of brown rice with pulses as that completes the protein by providing the missing amino acid. And veg also has protein too of course. Plus there is also all of the protein in my loose skin available to be utilised in other ways now. I only mention this as people always assume vegetarian and vegan diets struggle to get enough protein but that is a myth.

    I coped really well with my dentist’s appointment this week despite it going rather pear shaped as she couldn’t get my dratted broken tooth out. Apparently it is hooked under a thick bit of bone and there isn’t enough of it left to grab hold of. Another chunk of it broke off too. But she says it should be alright to leave. I could have had a referral for a procedure but I am not up for that. One step at a time! I had a filling done too so it wasn’t a complete waste of time and discomfort. I have been coping better with people too. Something seems to have shifted in my head and things are not as overwhelming as they were six months ago before I started fasting. And summer hours are upon me with longer work days – over ten hours yesterday, but I am able to face another long day today. A year ago I wouldn’t have been able to stay on my feet for long after just half of what I did yesterday. I was in a terrible state. I think fasting is improving more than just the hunger hormones. My neurotransmitters seem to be functioning better in so many ways as well. I am sleeping better, have less pain, less anxiety and I can think more clearly. My language learning has picked up too. I am making great progress. I found I could understand lots more of the Dutch audiobook I was playing to mask background noise as I slept last night. Whole paragraphs were completely understandable. The other night I was playing a Danish one that I couldn’t make head or tail of when I put it on before I went to sleep but by the morning I could understand most of what he was reading. The accent had been assimilated. And I am understanding most of the Norwegian series I am watching on all4 without looking at the subtitles, in fact I can see where what is said diverges from the subtitles, which is quite often. I have learned languages like this before but never several at the same time. I am working on Welsh too, and that is far less difficult than last time I tried it. Anyone reading this is probably a bit baffled by my wanting to do this, but I have Aspergers and do tend to get carried away with things. At least I am not memorising phone books!

    Wow fatrabbit, it’s great to read your post with such good news. Great to hear about all the improvements this lifestyle has brought to your life. That’s so inspirational.
    I find now that I am lighter, I am more fit as well. I had to help a woman with a removal and found that I did not get tired and painful afterwards. I did that on a fast day as well, and all that exercise made my weight go down almost a kilo next day. That felt great then. I have been very careful this weekend not to gain it all back again, so I should have a good base for my next fast day tomorrow.
    Next week is another difficult week though. I have to travel to Frankfurt on Tuesday for a meeting on Wednesday. That is always a challenge, to stay vegan, let alone low calorie. I might take some food items with me this time, like vegan cheese that I can use on the day. I do not like to make too much of a fuss for the others. These meetings are not my favorite kind of thing anyway.

    I am very impressed by your language learning skills. That is so cool how you manage to absorb new languages. I wish I could do that. I learned I English and French at school and I taught myself a little Spanish. That’s about it. I want to travel in the future, to Thailand next year again as my daughter is there, so it would be great to speak a bit of Thai, but those words go in one ear and out the other. Nothing sticks. Perhaps it’s my age too.
    Good you survived your dental appointments. Teath are a bummer, aren’t they.
    Interesting you say you are Asberges. How does that effect you in dayly life, apart from your phenomenal language skills?

    Under 200 lbs this morning:) And my BMI has dropped under 30. I am no longer Obese. Yay:)))

    It is great that you were able to do so much without hurting afterwards Poggy Vegan. I hope you can find healthy vegan things to eat while you in Frankfurt.

    The Aspbergers has a big impact on my life. I find some things neurotypical people take for granted very difficult. Mainly social things but also planning, or executive function as it is called. For example my problem with not coping with being referred to get the tooth sorted is not that I am squeamish or frightened by the idea but that I simply can’t manage the planning involved in getting there. I get severely travel sick unless I am driving but no longer have a car which makes going any distance very worrisome. I only coped with the normal dentist because I could walk there. I can’t cope with owning a car because I can’t cope with getting one repaired etc as the thought of talking to workmen sends me into a panic. I don’t even use a telephone. It is a sign of how much better I am feeling that I have been able to communicate using electronic means as I have on this forum. I don’t usually manage it as I find it difficult to see how people react to me. I know I don’t say the right things. Other impacts are with everyday things such as the fact that I always wear the same thing. I hate shopping and so when I have to I buy multiples. I have never worn makeup and don’t understand why people need more than one or two pairs of shoes. I need my routine although I am not as rigid as many with Aspergers. But there are many things that leave me feeling uneasy until I get them done. I get very focused on my current interests and am happy to spend all my time alone pursuing them. I won’t eat anything anyone else cooks and have very specific ideas about what goes with what. I take questions rather too literally and give too much information…

    I was starting to get a bit anxious again about possible metabolic slowdown from just eating 800 calories a day as it seems to go against the advice of Jason Fung and others saying restricted calorie diets are a bad idea because they cause an adaptation that conserves energy by limiting activity by reducing metabolic rate.

    I found this review showing that Jason Fung approves although he doesn’t directly address the apparent discrepancy:

    And then I found this article which does address it:

    It seems the difference is nutrition, as indeed I suspected. If you carefully use your 800 calories you can meet nutritional needs and so not cause the starvation effects that ruin your metabolism when you are actually starved and so you will not mess up your metabolic rate by doing it: “Mosley says it is possible to cut calories right down and still be adequately nourished, and he is adding his voice to those calling for a rethink on the recommended balance of fat and carbohydrates in our diets…Mosley advocates a simpler approach, cutting out these refined carbs altogether and replacing them with beans, lentils, chickpeas, quinoa and buckwheat, combined with lots of vegetables, the less-sweet fruits, quality proteins and fats from olive oil, nuts, yoghurt, butter, cheese and coconut. He dubs this the M-Plan, since mostly it is a low-carb version of the traditional Mediterranean diet. …
    So what of the 5:2 diet and intermittent fasting that until now have been the approach Mosley has energetically recommended? He hasn’t abandoned that and sees it as a gentler option for diabetics and pre-diabetics who struggle with a very low-calorie diet.

    “You won’t lose weight as fast as you would if you stuck to 800 calories a day but it can be more effective than conventional dieting.””

    The difference between the old style 5/2 and his new version is not to make it easier by adding extra calories but to make it more effective by getting rid of those dangerous sugars and processed carbs and emphasize the benefits of longer intermittent fasts by going longer without eating anything during the two fast days. The old 500/600 calorie level was never tested in any way anyway. I think getting the extra nutrition from those extra calories is more important than the minimal extra weight loss not eating them will get you. 600 calories in a week won’t make much of a difference if you look at it as a percentage. One poor choice on a NFD wipes that out in a few minutes.

    To safely do the full 800 calorie BSD I suspect you need to have enough fat to lose to supplement the restricted number of calories to keep your body functioning properly. I also suspect that the extra lose skin available to be broken down and re-utilised is helpful to supplement a lowered protein intake. Muscles that are being used are unlikely to be catabolised, that would make no evolutionary sense and research has shown it doesn’t happen.

    I found a calculator that shouted at me when I put in 800 calories saying I shouldn’t stay on that beyond 21st April as my fat level would be too low after that. Here is a link: https://keto-calculator.ankerl.com .

    I think I probably ate too much today. We were given loads of free food again that has gone out of date. I have been having so much fun cooking it. I couldn’t afford to buy such wonderful veg. Huge tubs of assorted cherry tomatoes, heaps of lovely peppers, tenderstem broccoli, samphire, exotic mushrooms, huge breakfast mushrooms, fresh kale…I can’t wait for asparagus season. Today I cooked the big breakfast mushrooms in a wok with onions and chili and then added kale, red pepper and fine beans cooked separately with ginger and mustard seeds to it, mainly because there was too much to ensure it cooked evenly had I cooked it all together. Then a potful of mashed spud with cloves for mum. I had just a taste of potato, three mushrooms and filled up the bowl with veg. It may have been under 400 but it also may not have been. But then the tomato and pepper sauce with black beans I had earlier that was left over from yesterday may have been under 400 and given me some leeway. The beans were under 150 calories, I know that much. The sauce was made with onions, peppers and tomatoes, a bit of olive oil and spices. Anyway it was all very healthy and I ate nothing else and will eat nothing else until at least 2pm tomorrow.

    All that free food sounds absolute delicious, fatrabbit. No wonder you were tempted to eat too much of it.
    I managed to stay vegan in Frankfurt, but I have definitely eaten too much. When I got onto the scales yesterday morning, I was over 1kg heavier. My lowest was 57.5kg and then up to 58.7kg. I am sorry I could not manage to eat well while travelling, but there it is, I have to get going my routine again. Today was supposed a fast day, but when I was shopping in my local Bioladen, they had delicious samples of spring rolls and I could not resist. In my work fridge I found a tub of potatoes that needed eating as well, so I decided it’s not going to be a fast day after all. Perhaps I will do a back to back on Sunday and Monday.
    Now that I have only about 5kg to loose, it gets so hard to stick with it.
    I found your links an interesting read.I am reluctant to give up the 5/2 model because it has worked so well for me so far. I think with the 800 kcal it is a job of trial and error to see what suits you best and works for you. I would weigh in frequency though to make sure you know what happens. I know you are not keen on that, but it might be good just to check on the effect of the different forms of the diet.

    I found it interesting what you wrote on the effects of the Asberges. I can see some annoying restrictions there for you, but also some behaviour that could happen in a lot of ordinary people. I used to get very travel sick as a child, but luckily lost it when I grew up.
    If you found it difficult to comunicate, well done writing on this forum.I have not noticed you not saying the right things in any way.I value your presence and find it interesting what you have to say.

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