A frustrating afternoon!
Every time I think the rain has stopped and I get about 15 minutes in to my gardening tasks, down it comes again and I have to go inside to dry off. Three times it happened now.

Thin – you’d better tell your brother not to bother getting up in the middle of the night to watch the first day of the day/night test in Adelaide. I really don’t think the covers will be coming off any time soon.

Great story. Poor kereru (is that also the plural?).

I’ll swap your wx LJ. 35C today, 37C tomorrow. It’s very changeable though and we’ve had some quite cool days this week.

good morning all,

Weighed this morning at 77.8kg the best I have been for a long time.

Hope everyone has a great day today.

catch up later

Fabulous news JJulie, very happy. Keep up the good work and, if you haven’t already, please report in on the Silly Season Challenge to encourage others. I don’t know how you manage the B2B fasts, I’m sure I’d cave in.

Cinque, it will be lovely when we read that you’re back fasting with us. It’s going to be 38C here today so I’m hurrying to get the garden watered and get the walk in early. We’ll be back out in the middle of day catching the ferry to town as we’re going to Cirque Du Soleil to see their final Perth performance at 1pm. The first time I saw them was in San Diego in the late eighties and we try to go whenever they come to town. No animals!

A three ring circus should be enough to distract me from hunger so I’ve decided to skip my 2pm cauliflower soup today and proceed straight to dinner at 5pm. So, it’ll be like a 24 hour fast (except for the almond & coconut milk, 20 cals, that I’m enjoying in my coffee now).

The only trouble with posting on two threads now is I feel I’m repeating myself.

I have lunch out today, but have planned ahead from the menu, so not expecting problems. It’s the wandering through the central market afterward that more of a risk.

Have a good day everyone.

Check-in: FD for me today and after what ended up being more than 1 Christmas thing over the weekend I’m starting at 66.3 That includes eating some quantity of things I now know make me retain extra fluid for a few days. My calorie gaol for this FD is 450cals.

Onwards and Downwards,
Merry

Hi all. Surgery went well….thanks to everyone for the well wishes.

The weekend away resulted in no weight gain. Surprisingly considering I indulged to the max – oysters, huge steak and sauce laidened vegies, cooked brekkies to name a few. Also overindulged on alcoholic beverages, beer, red wine and chivers regal. OH and I had a wonderful few days together…..oh and I received another beautiful box of flowers…..so very sweet.

It’s Monday…..back to reality. Hope everyone is traveling well.

Gday great to hear things are going so well for you.
Thin it is truly alarming to know how many of the ‘good food’ recommendations are driven by marketing. The food pyramid for example promoted a heavy intake of carb rich foods because of overproduction by American wheat farmers.. Sugar is another example…similar program ‘the sugar conspiracy’ I think it was called, found despite the industry knowing the risks of over consumption, they continued to promote it as a healthy food, just like the tobacco industry did with cigarettes until relatively recently. No wonder diabetes is at epidemic level.
For a while I followed a program called The Metabolism Miracle’ which severely restricted carbs for 8 weeks, before gradually reintroducing them. In the end it was just too damned hard to follow, without living like a hermit, and by comparison this 5:2 way of life is just so easy and sustainable. But the point I am getting to is that the author Diane Kress was scathing about the food recommendations of the American Diabetes Council, and how following its diet would in time push someone with high blood sugar into Type 2 diabetes. I am not for one second recommending the diet ….this 5:2 is something I intend to live by forever, but found her discussion of how dangerous some of these ‘expert’, marketing driven approaches to diet are – particularly when the pharmaceutical industry is also involved.

The problem with being a planner is that I get a bit stressed when my plans go awry.
I had pre-chosen what to order for lunch from the online menu. What I didn’t realise is that they offer a much smaller menu on Mondays as the central market isn’t open so they get fewer customers at the cafes. Their choices were pizza or a variety of deep fried schnitzels and wedges.

We decided to order one big pizza for everyone to share. Thankfully the others were OK with half of it being vegetarian as I’m not keen on most of the meats that go on pizza. I was happy that I only ate a modest amount and so far it hasn’t triggered a desire to keep eating – which has pleasantly surprised me.

I doubt that the amount I ate has done much damage, but I have a FD planned for tomorrow which should take care of any extra grams from today.

Ditto!

Hi everyone
Love reading all your discussions, comments, etc. Try to take it all in – everything sounds so helpful. Thank you all.
Just got back from my first walk with the dogs in what seems like ages – we don’t like bindies & it seems they are now few & far between, so we can now walk on the footpath, not the tar roads which get quite hot! Looking forward to doing it again – the dogs are exhausted, but happy.
Had a FD today – not exactly 500 cals, not much over – overall pretty good. The miso soup helps, low cals, tastes good – I hadn’t tried it till very recently. Herbal teas help as well. It feels so much better having more control over when & what I eat – portion sizes are smaller, don’t really get hungry, very satisfied with what I can eat! Though sometimes I still have the odd sweet treat, but feel if I eat it occasionally then I don’t crave it.
Looking forward to a good sleep, only 5 hours broken sleep last night – no reason why!
Hope you are all happy with what you are doing. Enjoy your week & bye for now!

Penguin you are so right, that the funding is a good place to start with scientific/academic articles. But you just don’t expected august institutions that are meant to look after the health of a nation to be open to what pretty much amounts to bribery and corruption, whether it’s from the food industry or the pharmaceutical industry. Individuals perhaps, but whole boards of specialists? But if these programs are to be believed, that’s what’s happened, unfortunately.
Not a FD for me today but no dinner – both of us aren’t really up to another restaurant meal. (That’s something I never thought I’d ever write). We’ll see what the scales say tomorrow!
Hope your GD is better, and you enjoy each other’s company.

Cinque, your doctor is probably right about the feeling ‘off’ having to do with the aftermath of your surgery. Your recovery seems pretty quick to me. You probably don’t have to worry about getting your appetite back eventually. The drugs they gave you to keep you under, and then the pain killers afterward all have their effects. Consider yourself lucky that you aren’t ravenous after not eating much for several days. Everything I’ve read recommends protein to help with healing, so it’s probably good to concentrate on that.

Thin, my OH has gone along with a vegan diet, at least at home, for months at a time in the past. If I’m cooking something he likes, he’s happy, and has eaten enough vegan and vegetarian dishes over the years that they are familiar. A lot of them are somewhat high in calories though. Coconut milk as an ingredient makes just about anything taste good (kind of like butter) and various types of nuts, nut butters, pastas, etc. all taste pretty good and mainstream. It’s tougher to cook low calorie and vegan without resorting to more veggies or soups than he would normally eat in a meal.

At one time I went on a total vegan diet for about a year, to try to normalize my cholesterol. I have inherited high cholesterol. A vegan diet will drop it close to 100 points in a matter of weeks, but to get it down further requires statins. (Which I found out with this year long experiment.) I did find that my weight normalized as long as I didn’t go totally crazy. For example, I couldn’t eat a steady diet of potato crisps or a ton of oils. But pasta and whole grains didn’t cause a problem. Maybe because of all the beans I was eating, I actually ate less due to all the fiber. This was around 10 years ago. It was the closest I’ve ever gotten to eating whatever I wanted without gaining weight. Having to eat out a lot because of my job, and just liking to eat out was what made me go back to eating animal products. But I truly felt better eating that way. And being an animal lover, there’s the ethical side of it.

Penguin, I’m still trying to figure out who the enemy was. I’m thinking it’s the restaurant as they changed the rules on me. But it could be my lunch buddies too, they all decided on pizza and I couldn’t see any better alternative on the limited menu. I did manage to insert some sabotage though, asking for veggies only on half. Glad I did it too, as they chose salami ham & chilli for the other half (no veg at all unless you count the fresh chillies).
In previous times a meal like this would have triggered cravings that had me snacking all afternoon. I don’t understand why it didn’t have this effect of me yesterday.
Hope you enjoy your days looking after your grand-daughter.

Lindsay, Thin & Cinque, I’ve noticed a lot more documentaries in recent years attempting to highlight the issues with diet and what is really healthy and also who and what influences public policy. I actually think that informing the public repeatedly about this is probably the best way to go, because we need public pressure to instigate change. Unless enough people complain, public policy won’t change. I think there are too many people in western societies who would rather receive medical treatment for a problem than change their eating habits and lifestyle. I think it will take more people willing to change to a healthier lifestyle to apply pressure for better information. I see this within my own family.
There are a couple of men in my extended family who are type 2 diabetics who failed to control it with diet and had to go onto insulin injections. Both were happy to do this as they felt it gave them a free ticket to go back to eating what they liked as the insulin injections would take care of it. Nothing I’ve said has gotten them out of this mindset. They had professional support to change their diets, they just didn’t want to do it.
Although that said, there are some things that really do require medication and can’t be solved with diet and exercise. As Cali mentioned, inherited high cholesterol does usually need statins. A friend of my ex-husband was obsessive with his diet and exercise due to a family history of high cholesterol and early death from heart attack. Nothing he did with diet and exercise got his cholesterol down to acceptable levels and he genuinely tried hard to do this over several years – he was determined not to die in his 40s like his father and grandfather.

Cinque, I totally agree. I think Michael Pollan’s simple advice is spot on.

Cali, I’ve never been vegan, but was vegetarian for a few years in my 30s. I agree that some vegan/vegetarian food can be high calorie, especially from the nut and oil content. I mostly still prefer it though to meat dishes. I find it interesting that quite a few of us on this thread were vegetarian at some point in our past. I think one thing it teaches you is to enjoy all veg varieties and to be creative with them. You also learn how to look more broadly at protein instead of assuming it has to come from meat. I’d barely eaten any legumes before becoming vegetarian and even though I haven’t been vegetarian for many years, the love of legumes has remained with me.

Arelkade, I’m glad you are finding your rhythm with fasting. I hope your sleep improves. I used to be a terrible sleeper, having trouble getting to sleep and staying asleep. The things that have helped me the most are to eat a generous but healthy dinner and to eat nothing after that in the evening. I also cut out caffeine after 5pm. Since making these changes I’ve noticed that once I get to sleep I do usually stay asleep. Getting to sleep easily can still be an issue for me, but I notice that when I’ve had a physically active day it is easier. So I think being physically tired is also a contributor to getting to sleep easily. Hopefully you’ll find out which things help you soon.

GDSA, happy to hear that the surgery went well this time.

FD for me today.

Hi all, a late post from me because I was at a Silly Season event that started mid-morning to accommodate some who needed to leave early. I had to get my walk in very early today.

Arelkade, you had a good FD and a good walk with the dogs.

Cinque, I hope you soon feel very good. I am so pleased to have you posting again. Do take care.

Good to read the conversation. CalifD, yes I realise those national health associations are not US government organisations, sorry if my post implied that when I mentioned that the US govt. employs people to devise recipes that promote the animal food industry which these organisations use on their websites. There was also a horrid segment on the health consequences of pig farming to low socio-economic residents of a county in North Carolina, a place I called home for eight years, but had no idea these practices existed. I’m not singling out America; it just happened to be a US doco.

I do accept that data can be manipulated to demonstrate a desired outcome. But you have to ask yourself, why would the guy heading up the Diabetes Association be so defensive about discussing the role of diet in preventing diabetes or reversing its symptoms? A long-time poster of this thread, now resident on the MC thread, Purple Vegie Eater, claims that the symptoms of her husband’s diabetes were reversed when they began practicing IF. She calls the Australian Diabetes Association ‘charlatans’.

Cinque, I love your tips for disguising reduced meat consumption and already practice them. I feed my OH red meat about once or twice a week. But I think I serve too much chicken. I’m more concerned about his lunch choices as it’s not lunch unless it’s a sandwich containing processed meat. Consuming 50gm of processed meat per day can increase your chance of colo-rectal cancer by 18% but he doesn’t believe it.

When I was a vegetarian, I found that many people would actually choose the dishes I was eating when presented with a choice. I remember it took quite a lot of effort to prepare some of the dishes I made.

CalifD, when you were vegan, did you go the whole way – no sitting on leather chairs, etc or was it purely for health reasons? Vegan is possibly a step too far for me but I am motivated to make further changes, not just for my family but to improve the planet. It’s not for everyone of course! By the time I’ve cut out sugar, meat, dairy, wheat, farmed fish, alcohol, etc I’m wondering if it would be easier to make a brief list of what I can have.

LJ, that’s a shame about your family members being content to rely on medication. We are lucky here because we’re all motivated to make changes for the best health outcomes. I laughed at your McD post although it’s really no laughing matter.

At my event today, the topic of 5:2 came up. There were six of us actively practicing 5:2 including the lady who turned me on to it in the first place and another two who are doing it with less conviction. We also talked a lot about 16:8. Our lunch feast looked so colourful, which to my mind, represented a very healthy spread. The others all had champagne but I drank water as I was driving and anyway I don’t enjoy white wine.

So Amazon officially launched its Aussie web site today, CalifD. I must have a look at what’s on offer. A retailer on the car radio was saying that 85% of purchases in Australia are made in a physical retail outlet. He thinks Amazon will have little impact on this. It will be interesting to follow.

Hi everyone,
I have been catching up on the last couple of pages of posts.
I skipped a FD the other week due to a function with dinner. I didn’t miss it (the FD) but felt guilty the next day. It would be easy to fall off the wagon without reminders of what we are doing here. Knowing there is the support of the forum here keeps me in check as I feel I have to report to you guys about what I am doing.
I went to Melbourne last weekend for a family Christmas do. I went to the shops as well for some clothes for me and the kids, I tell you when you drop another clothes size it is a good feeling. A shirt I was wearing a couple of months ago is like a potato sack on me now and it will be retired. The new shorts are a size 36 and the shirts an XL. This is down from a 3XL and size 40 at Christmas last year.
Merryme some good things to think about with planning for holidays and 5:2 in general. Last year when I was on holidays for 3 weeks I did 2 FD’s week one, 1 FD week two and none week three but had a FD within a day or two upon returning home and this felt comfortable for me whilst on holidays. Who knows what I will do this year when away however I do think it will be a least one FD per week.
Meals for FD:
2 x white coffee’s 300kj, 500g minestrone soup 800kj, 100g kidney beans 400kj and 150g mushrooms 175kj

Good morning all,

I have just realised what day it is. I forgot to fast on Monday probably because I was thinking it was still Sunday. Then yesterday I fasted without even trying. Monday night we had really bad storms and I lost power in the house. It is not unusual for us to loose power during storms but this was only me, no-one else in the street. Anyhow there I was at 11.00pm downstairs in the rain with a torch trying to reset the power. I noticed that there was two switches that had tripped out and I struggled to get them back on. I thought I had the power back on but could not get the lights to half of the house on. In the end I gave up because I had been downstairs about eight time resetting the switches and they were not working. I went to bedand decided to worry about it in the morning.

So yesterday I had to ring an electrician to come to find out what was wrong. The first one I rang tried to get me to reset the switches while we were talking over the phone. It was clear he just did not want to come to the house. So after talking to a neighbour to see if I could make a cup of coffee she put me onto her electrician who although could not come out straight away said he could in a couple of hours. My neighbour made room in her spare freezer and fridge so I could transfer all of my stuff over so I did not loose food. The humidity and heat was so bad and I really got up a sweat. After a nice ice cold drink at my neighbours house, the electrician arrived. He checked everything and got the power on could not give an answer as to why it all happened except for a gekko probably running over some wiring in the switchboard and causing the problem. Ok he left and I rang OH to tell him power now on, but as I was talking to him I opened the fridge to get another drink and realised it was off again. Hang up from OH quickly to ring back the electrician before he got too far away. He returned and we started troubleshooting appliances. In the end he changed the safety switch and all has been good since.
I was going to spend the day cleaning in preparation for airport pickup this morning but by the time the electrician left I was exhausted. No food just drinks all day, then some cheese and crackers with a glass of wine later in the evening. I just did not even think about a fast day at all.
So this morning I realised here it is Wednesday and I really have not had a proper FD this week.
Weight is 77.8kg – a little more than Monday morning when I weighed 77.1Kg but after the events of the last two days I am not caring.
I will fast today and see how all goes.

Arelkade, Glad you have found you like miso soup. If you want to bulk it up at any time without adding too many calories you can add the low cal noodles or the Konyaku ribbons to it. Also spinach, daikon, bean sprouts and mushrooms are good in it too.

I was interested to read how many of us were at one stage vegetarian/vegan. I never used to eat red meat at all and when I met OH was totally white meat only with some seafood but heaps of vegies. When I was young I would eat all my vegies but not the meat. I still love vegies heaps and can bulk up a dish with heaps of them, but I had to eat some red meat due to a blood disorder or I was not getting enough iron.

That is why when I eat vegetarian I can only do so for a few weeks at a time then I have to have some red meat. I hate taking iron pills or getting the injections.

Must go now as it is a busy day today. I have been up for 5 hours already but still more to do before tomorrow.

Hello all. Was going to have a FD today but felt way too hungry this morning so will give it a miss and do later this week.

Haha Penguin….bar the surgery it’s a pretty enticing combination of eats and drinks !! Enjoyed the oysters so much we’re planning a drive after xmas to Cowell (2 hrs away) to buy some fresh from the farm for another treat.

Looking forward to xmas day this year. Spending the whole day at OH’s daughters house where all his kids and grandkids will gather to celebrate…..all 30 of them !! Will make a change for MissD and I as we’ve spent the last 3 xmas’ just the 2 of us at home so she will enjoy having lots of kids to play with as i will enjoy the adult company.

Kefir is still going well. Every morning i have a berry smoothie and the grains are multiplying. I enjoy my ritual of separating the grains etc to make more. OH thinks its weird…..leaving milk out of the fridge for 2 days and then drinking it, especially in the Aussie hot climate. I will convert him….in time.

Back to work for me. Take care everyone and happy fasting

Jj – what surprises me is that kefir doesn’t smell or taste like sour milk. It is sour, but a much milder flavour and smell. The texture is thick but pourable – about the thickness of single cream.
It’s not very different to the process for making yoghurt. That starts of as milk and culture that has to be left to ferment in a warm environment for a few hours. Although with yoghurt getting the temperature and timing right is more important.

Thin – I too looked for bluapple on amazon.au and then realised it was actually being supplied by Kitchen Warehouse through amazon (Kitchen Warehouse is an online retailer I’ve bought from directly before). So I decided to see who else stocked it. The company that brings it to Australia also sell it directly: http://www.whitemagic.biz/product-category/bluapple/ I think the Combopack (which isn’t offered on Amazon) is better value as the sachets in the apples have to be replaced every 3 months and the basic pack doesn’t come with any refills.

This helps answer my question about possible side effects of kefir. And whether they are actually caused by kefir itself. https://www.probioticscenter.org/probiotics-adverse-effects/

Cinque – are you feeling OK today?

Quick comment – I have a work colleague who tried kefir and got a skin rash….she is incredibly sensative to all sorts of things though i might add. I put mine in the fridge and use cold. In regards to temperature, the warmer the air temp the quicker it ferments (if that’s the right term for it ? ) i dont think it tastes sour at all….perhaps I’m just used to the taste now.

Well the afternoon tea was a disappointment. I was very picky about what I ate and in the then end I ate one macaroon and tasted 2 cakes (about 1/4 slice of each). Even the tea left a lot to be desired. So I’ve come home and made myself a proper pot of tea, which I will now sit down and enjoy. I’m glad I can sometimes manage not to eat food just because it’s there, especially when the quality just isn’t worth it.

Cinque, glad to hear you are making progress. I hope your pain levels have reduced as well.

Hi everyone
Looks like it’s going to be a lovely day in Gloucester today.
LJoyce & Just Julie: thank you for your recent comments, much appreciated. I do feel I need to exercise more, esp in the evening ie walking – the dogs will love it & I will sleep better – this is a recent problem!
Thin, LJ & JJ: I never knew about miso soup till joining this forum so thanks for all your suggestions to bulk it up – really like the taste of it.
I enjoy my milk kefir on muesli with banana, blueberries & apricots – was using 100g, throwing rest away – now happy to cool it & make a smoothie later. Thought it might go sour if kept!!! Still a lot to learn. Would like to venture into sauerkraut next – any suggestions most welcome.
Cinque: so glad you are feeling better each day.
OH & I have a Probus Christmas Lunch today – looking forward to the challenge of eating within moderation & having a good time with lovely people.
Hope you all enjoy whatever you are getting up to today.
Bye for now!

Good morning everyone.
Arelkade, ignoring the British timestamp you are still up bright and early, I do hope it was after a better sleep!

I am feeling better each day thanks, and I am taking it gently. The pain is less. Hooray.

Cali, so sorry to hear of those fires again too, it must be so exhausting, even if they are not effecting you directly.

LJoyce, what a pity the afternoon tea was a disappointment. But I am glad you got your own excellent cuppa at the end of it.

It is a beautiful morning here, and I have the whole day to potter about (and make the red kidney bean stew).

best wishes all.

Thin, the Blueapples seem to be more expensive on the au site, but that isn’t taking exchange rates into account. Amazon.au doesn’t have Prime shipping yet, which makes a lot of items more attractive here. We pay $99 per year for ‘free’ 2 day shipping on most, but not all, Amazon items. The weight doesn’t matter. I once ordered a sewing machine and it came within 2 days with no additional shipping costs. That will probably come on the au site as they begin to carry more items and as more people start ordering, I would think. Thin, I often forget to replace the inside granules in the Blueapples for 4 months or more. They seem to still have some effect as they get older.

I agree that sour milk is a lot different than kefir. Sour milk tastes kind of bitter as well as sour and it smells awful! I guess that’s because it’s spoiling and has bad bacteria in it instead of fermenting and being preserved like with kefir. The kefir grains are what gets it fermenting with good bacteria. I like it more sour than most people. In the summer, when it’s warm in the kitchen, that takes about 24 hours. In the winter, that can take as long as 48;hours. I can tell when it’s ready because the curds and whey are well separated. I have to stir it a little before I strain it to make it easier to strain. Even after the grains are out, it will ferment a little more if I leave it out. I’ve never left it out of the frig for more than a few hours. It would be interesting to see if it would spoil. LJoyce, I agree that the taste is similar to yogurt. But it is so much less fussy with temperatures and timing than making yogurt. I can start it with really cold milk and let it sit out in a cold room and it still ferments.

Lindsay, are you staying in Bali because of cancelled flights, or just because you want to continue your vacation? I’ve never traveled there, but the pictures I’ve seen of it are beautiful. The birds and wildlife are amazing. But the Australia has no shortage of beautiful wildlife.

The fires are in Southern California, about 5 hours from here by car. But I know people who live near enough to them to be concerned. Like the fires in Northern California, there are high wind which make it spread quickly. Also, much of it is in the mountains and canyons which makes it very difficult to fight except by air. I heard that something like 27,000 people had been evacuated at one point. Very scary indeed.