Hello Southern Hemispherites!!

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  • Cinque – so happy for you!! Hope today is a very restful one and Miso good soft company today.

    Seems the best possible outcome. Re: breathing – maybe the non-change is because of the ME/CFS shallow breathing thing. (Info for others – ME/CFS forces shallower breathing than normal. eg after 19 1/2 years I’m finally able to breath a bit deeper.)

    Soft hugs to you💐🍏
    Merry

    Oh Cinque, hope you and OFMs are OK today and over the weekend in the rain. So good your appt was yesterday, not today. Stay safe.

    Everyone else in Victoria – stay safe too, no taking chances. If in doubt don’t. During flood rain and flood events nothing is as important as staying safe.

    Note to newbies and relative newbies re posting:

    While you will see us answering each other at times; comments to multiple people; talk on non 5:2 topics, none of these are obligatory or expected. They are bonuses. You neither have to read them all or answer them.

    The chat on the thread waxes and wanes, changes course, changes topics etc, our most important topic is:

    information on 5:2

    how to get through a FD

    encouragement

    checking in with our progress

    5:2 friendly foods

    calories/kilojoules of 5:2 friendly foods

    5:2 friendly behaviours

    TDEE and 1/4 of TDEE

    eliminating non-5:2 behaviours and emotions

    asking and ansering 5:2 questions

    doing 5:2 during challenging times eg life events, Christmas, visitors, around OFMs (other family members

    any special needs you have that might affect your ability to do 5:2, or need different strategies

    5:2 trouble shooting

    Southern Hemispherites Recipes are in another thread. We ask that if you are posting a recipe there , please no chat, just the recipe and calories per serve. That makes the recipe thread easily usable. Lots of good recipes there.

    NB
    some of us are cooks or love cooking. Some of us aren’t cooks and some thoroughly dislike cooking. Some of us exercise regularly and we encourage you to do so. There are at least 2 of us unable to exercise at all, as we have chronic medical stuff, but we’re cheering the exercisers on, and would love to be doing it too.

    Regardless, we’re all using 5:2 to improve our health and some normalising weight from various starting points. Some get there faster, some slower; we eat and drink different things to each other; we’re different ages and female and male.

    We suggest you hang around on the thread for awhile, post your progress regularly, and no question is too silly or simple to ask.

    Onwards and Downwards
    If you fall of the horse get straight back on it
    Merry

    Hi Everyone

    Cinque, so glad your case was reviewed and now everything has worked out so well. Take it easy over the next couple of days.
    MerryMe , thanks for that list of how you manage holidays. We have travelled the last 7 years in our Winter and gone to warmer climates from between 4-9 weeks and I usually come home 4-5 kg heavier and lose about 3 quite easily, the next couple take me ages!!
    CaliF, I with you as in this month my weight has gone up and down in the 58-59.6 range. Its a very social time of year.
    Julie, I did love your amazing photos!
    well the rain has started and hasn’t stopped! We are supposed to have our DDs wedding celebrant, with his wife, come tonight for dinner tonight to see the birth certificates etc and send off the vital information so our DD can get married on January 20th 🙂 I hope the rain doesn’t stop him. I think the forecasted storms have been revised-just warnings of flooding. Im supposed to meet up for Christmas celebrations with 4/5 of my old school friends tomorrow. I dont know if ill go as I will have to drive over the Dandenongs-windy, very treed, road.
    The celebrations started last night as I met up with ex work colleagues. we had a great night out with Nasty Kris Kringle.
    I did have a good fast day on Tuesday but that was the only day i could do one. My next one will be Monday.
    Have a great day/evening all!! xx

    Checkin – 2nd day after FD – 65.3, Had a lunch out with friends yesterday and Christmas do tomorrow, so will do my 2nd FD for the week today. Lunch out report – had single main – left a bit on the plate, sparkling water (from Iceland!) and peppermint tea.

    FDs usually Mon/Thur changed to Wed/Fri this week.

    Good morning all,

    I am not too happy with myself this morning as I seem to have put on a bit. Yesterday was probably my undoing. We went to an event for the Birthday of the Emperor of Japan and I had a couple of glasses of bubbly, then they had fingerfood which I dont usually have, but tried a couple of things.
    Then after I decided that I did not want to cook when we got home so we went to one of the restaurants by the Marina. OH wanted souvlaki which is what I wanted as it came with salad, then he also wanted to try the slow cooked lamb with mediteranean vegetables, so he suggested that I order one and he order the other and we could share. BIG MISTAKE !!!! He got the souvlaki with the salad and then did not want to share. He does not like a lot of salad so most of it went to waste. I was not so happy with my meal in the end.

    So today I was up at 4am to take him to the airport. Good bye!!!! at least until Sunday, so now I can have 2 full days of fasting and not have to worry about any other food that other people in the house might want!!!!

    I am going to start with a coffee, black no sugar!!!
    Miso soup for lunch.
    I will make cauliflower and broccoli soup to have for dinner.

    Thin, I am going to the supermarket today so i will look for the steel cut oats again. We have both Coles and Woolworths at this little shopping centre so can try them both.

    Cinque I have not read the article yet but I am going to today. But I read LJoyce’s comments which were very interesting. Daughter isso much better, the trip to Japan really perked her up. She has even applied for a new job on her return.Christmas shopping will be easy this year. Just one present for each daughter!! OH will be difficult but I am sure he will let me know what he wants.

    LinsayL, Yes good to be home as this trip was tiring and we were unable to wash clothes along the way for most of it. (could wash the first couple of days at hostel in Kyoto but then not anywhere until the last night in Osaka) I threw out two pairs of socks that had developed holes in them and am unsure if it was because they were old or just because they had not been washed. But bought 3 pairs of new ones at 100 yen shop. I have already planned the next one for April next year and all accommodation is booked but will check to see if we can wash clothes at these places. (The accommodation in USJ did say they had coin operated machines, that is why I booked it, but when we got there they did not. We checked the website and was convinced it said there were machines on the 4th floor, so questioned staff again to be told that they were in the other hotel of that belonged to them which was the tower next door!! Very misleading information on their website!!!) Hence tick that hotel off the list of visiting again!!!

    So yes today is December 1st and for some of us the beginning of summer and others the beginning of winter. Personally I love winter these days and just dont seem to enjoy the tropical summers at all. My vegie garden is dying off with the heat, even though I am watering it each morning.

    Better get to and do some work before the morning is over!!

    Bye for now…

    No more excuses! Here’s the Silly Season Challenge. Who’s in?
    https://thefastdiet.co.uk/forums/topic/the-second-annual-silly-season-challenge/

    MerryMe, great list for the newbies on this thread. Thank you for posting it. If I could add just one more: Don’t be afraid to jump in any place on or off topic. You can see that we get off on a variety of subjects at the drop of a hat and you are welcome to do that too. We’ll be happy to join in with our ideas, possibly more opinions than there are people. 😁

    Cinque, I’m breathing such a sigh of relief that your results were so good. I wondered if they still did the keyhole surgery. No wonder you’re sore, having to get half a lung through a keyhole! But then any woman who can climb through a kitty door…They must have had to do some serious pushing and shoving to accomplish that! But can I lodge a complaint? Making you and your sister wait for 2 hours when waiting for that kind of information is just inexcusable. I know very well how agonizing it can be. If the surgeon wasn’t available it seems like they could have had an assistant at least tell you that the news was good, they got it all, but you’d have to wait for the surgeon to give you the details. It would have saved some anxiety and worrying. But maybe you aren’t a professional worrier like I am and managed to stay calm. But my complaint still stands! 🤨

    Well said CalifD!!!!!

    Hi everyone, welcome to December and all that usually entails. I’m glad to be here and with 5:2 and mindful eating in my toolbag to deal with December’s challenges this year.

    Cinque, I am so very glad that you had good news on the lung cancer – eventually (what a way to get the stress levels up).
    And yes, I did have a good experience with my treatment this week, thank’s for asking. Apart from a bit of fatigue, no other side effects this time.

    Merry, that’s a good idea to let others know they can jump onto this thread. When a group are in full chat mode it can be a bit intimidating to intrude. I also sometimes wonder what our discussions must look like to the observer – talk about going off on tangents all the time. But then I never have been very good at staying on topic.

    Stay, I hope the wet weather doesn’t do any damage where you are. We had rain and thunder all night here but I can’t see any damage in mine or surrounding gardens this morning which is good. (The storms last December were not so kind.)

    JJulie, I think the lesson is to order what you want for you dinner. I know it’s easy to get railroaded into pleasing other people, but there is nothing selfish about ordering the meal you want to eat for yourself from a menu.

    Thin, thankyou for setting up the December pledge thread. I’ll go over there shortly – one I decide on my list of pledges. In preparation I actually weighed myself this morning. I was 78.3kg, which is about a kilo less than when I started maintaining in May. Some will remember that my original goal was 78kg but I got stuck in the 79s for months and in the end I accepted that 79 was fine. In the subsequent months whenever I weighed I was always 79-80.5, so this is a recent change. Given all that shortbread I ate earlier in the week, I’m a bit surprised. It explains why my favourite size 12 summer skirt felt so comfortable to wear yesterday – the waist had been a tight fit for quite a while now.

    I have food challenges next week, with lunches and afternoon teas scattered across the week. So I’m thinking I’ll start early and squeeze in a FD tomorrow, which will technically be a third for this week. But that’s OK as I’ve had 2 NFDs in a row. Also, this evening I’m going to a local twilight craft fair with my cousin to do some christmas shopping. Dinner will probably be food from one of more stalls so I expect a FD will probably feel appropriate tomorrow.

    Wow, so many posts in the last 24 hours! I see this as a good thing – many of us are here to get the support we need from like-minded people. It works! But I fear this is going to be a lengthy reply.

    Cinque, I can’t believe I neglected to send best wishes for your appointment yesterday. I remembered the night before and thought of you yesterday. So, I’m delighted to read that you’ve given lung cancer the big heave-ho.

    Lindsay & LJ, thanks for the info on Aussie time zones. So, its nick-name Adelayed is well-deserved, a bit like Wait Awhile for WA. Hope the surgery went OK GDSA.

    CalifD, thanks for your kind comments about my DD. I’m very proud of her for following her passion & probably go on about her a bit too much. You and I seem to be hovering around the same weight. I did get to 58.5kg a few times but haven’t been able to sustain that so I’ve become content with 60-61kg.

    Merry, thanks for reminding us of the travel tips. It’s lovely to have you back here posting regularly. You’ve done a great job in the scheme of things to have only gained 3kgs during this crappy year. It could have been a lot worse had you given up, so well done for fitting it in when you could. I continue to hang on to the belief that there are other health benefits to fasting besides just weight loss (and all that maintaining a healthy weight brings with it). I just wish I could enjoy the benefit of a clearer mind which hasn’t happened yet. In the new year, I will start learning Bridge in a continued effort to stave off dementia. Anyone else play?

    I’m with you Merry, I definitely prefer to incorporate 5:2 (or some modified form of it) into whatever’s happening in my life rather than coming up from behind facing several extra kilos that have to be dealt with after the fact. 5:2 is part of my life whether travelling, over-eating at Christmas or anything else life chucks at me.

    Just this morning, OH threw me into a panic asking if I’d like to go out for breakfast. I got out of it without upsetting him too much. If he’d share a big breakfast with me, I’d be more inclined but he’s not Mr Merry or Mr JJulie.

    Penguin, cheery pubs with log fires, hearty fare and a goose in the freezer. That’s what Christmas will always mean to me, well maybe not the goose but I bet it’ll be tasty. How will you cook it? I’ll content myself with a 42C day at the beach which never seems quite right but is fun nevertheless. I agree with you JJulie, I find the hot weather more draining as I age. I understand that post-menopausal women have greater difficulty in regulating their body temperature. A bit like our lizards.

    Stay, you are such a great weight to be the proud mother of the bride! Exciting times for all of you. I hope you have an outfit that shows off your waistline.

    LJ, great news on the scales for you too! I hope you will face this month with confidence in yourself. You have come so far.

    That’s covered all the posts that were there when I started this so if I’ve overlooked anyone who’s since posted, please forgive me.

    Have a great FD today JJulie and Merry.

    Thin, is a day at the beach the way most Australians celebrate Christmas? Because it’s usually cold here, even in Northern California, Christmas is usually more like Penguin’s, with a warm fire, lots of food and friends and family. Bulky sweaters are the mode of dress rather than swimsuits. The low temperature here tonight is predicted to be 6 C. Christmas drinks are things like Irish coffee, hot buttered rum or hot eggnog with brandy & rum. Hot mulled wine is another. I guess the weather has a lot to do with the way a holiday is celebrated. Christmas dinner could be outdoors there.

    How does everyone here celebrate the holidays?

    CalifD, the first Christmas we were here, we knew not a soul. So we thought, we’d go to the beach like many Aussies. We opened our presents to each other, I’d given OH a huge book entitled, “Dangerous Creatures of Australia” and he me one entitled, “Crocodile Attack”. We sat on the beach looking at these terrifying images, too scared to go in the water – and have yet to do so! Since that first year, we’ve kept up our little tradition of visiting the beach on Christmas morning every year. As you know, we live near the Swan river and we don’t otherwise think about going to the beach very often.

    We alternate hosting Christmas with long-time family friends (unless either of us is overseas). Despite the heat, we continue the English tradition of the hot roast turkey, ham and all the trimmings. Silly hats and Christmas crackers. It’s mad really but it’s what we do! This is my year off so I have no excuses for buying any food-like substances not eaten during the rest of the year.

    CalifD, I know you’ve been listening to Christmas music for days and enjoying your decs. I still can’t get into it yet. We will put up a tree and decorate eventually. Maybe you can send us a photo of your decorations to get me in the mood. When it snows, I’ll get motivated.

    Penguin & Cali I have to admit I’m a bit jealous. I have a dream of experiencing a white christmas – I’ll get to it one day.

    Cali, I think christmas traditions in Australia have varied with the generations and with migration. There’s also a lot of variation between families.
    Despite the heat my mother always did a traditional European style christmas – roast turkey, pork & ham, roast veg. Christmas pudding and custard… All in a Riverland summer where it was usually 35-45C and in a house without air-conditioning. My dad’s side of the family however, still adhere absolutely to this with hot roast turkey and flaming cloth-boiled brandy soused pudding. The only concession is that the turkey gets roasted in the Webber BBQ rather than the oven.

    Over the last 30 years my immediate family has moved away from that to include more seafood and salads. The “special” savoury food that we have only on christmas day is now Moreton Bay bugs (a crustacean native to the bay near Brisbane). Most cooking is either done the day before or on the outdoor BBQ – we do lots of meats & seafood on skewers that are easy to grill. There is usually still roast turkey and ham but it’s served cold with salads.
    The other big change is the abolition of the christmas pudding because most of my generation and younger didn’t like it. Our dessert tradition for the last 2 decades has been pavlova and a special fruit salad that includes all our favourite summer fruits (raspberries, strawberries, cherries, peaches, nectarines). Making the pavlova was always my job, but 2 years ago I handed the recipe and responsibility over to my niece’s youngest son as he discovered a love of baking. The only person who initially complained about the lack of christmas pudding was my brother in law – until he realised he was getting pavlova instead. To say pavlova is his absolute favourite dessert is no understatement. He agreed to stop moaning as long as he got to keep all the leftover pavlova – not that there is much – and he keeps an eye on anyone going back for seconds.

    I’ve never had christmas at the beach, but then I’ve never lived near the ocean. Until the late 1990s, my mother’s extended family (3-4 generations) always got together for a christmas evening BBQ. It was a big family, even when I was young there were well over 100 of us. My father used to dress up as santa claus and hand out small presents to the youngest kids. He’d always find some novel way to show up (on the roof, or riding on the back of a tractor, to name a few).

    Christmas day for me this year will be in the Riverland at my sister’s house. I’m planning to do a day trip (about 4 hours of driving in total). Her house will be full of kids and grandkids and I don’t relish sleeping on the couch or trying to find other accommodation.

    I hope everyone has nice plans for christmas that involves spending some time with people they like.

    There are three things I have learnt today. Two of them from members on this forum and one I worked out myself, but probably it has been mentioned on this forum in the past and I have not seen it!!!

    1. DO NOT GO FOOD SHOPPING ON A FAST DAY – You end up buying things for a NFD that you want to eat today!!

    2. LJoyce – Thank you for the lesson on menu choices. I will definitely order what I want in future and not trust OH to do the sharing!!!

    3. Someone mentioned TDEE today or yesterday and about not going over your TDEE on NFDs and only having 1/4 on FDs, which then got me thinking I had not checked my TDEE in quite awhile in fact I think for about 6 weeks or so. So thank you to that person (hands up whoever you are) because my TDEE today is 1813 which must mean my intake for a FD must have to be 453.25 when I had been thinking 500.

    So please am I right?

    That’s correct JJulie. Definitely eat no more on a FD than one quarter of your current TDEE. Preferably, and something to work towards, we should be eating for the TDEE of the weight you want to be. Many of us have achieved substantial weight loss on ‘diets’ in the past only to resume eating ‘normally’ once the weight came off. But ‘eating normally’ was for the weight we started out at. That’s why we gained all the weight back. We must ultimately learn to eat for the weight we want to sustain.

    Another little cruel irony besides requiring less food at our new healthy weight is that we require less food as we age. Yesterday, I took some of LJ’s statistics and played around with them in the calculator on this page. Over the time that LJ recorded her substantial weight loss from 2012, she also aged 5 years. OK, it wasn’t a huge percentage but amounted to about a small handful of almonds per day for each year gained. Something to think about.

    Hi everyone
    Really enjoying all your posts.
    Thanks to Merry for your list of great ideas re tips, etc for 5:2, much appreciated.
    Also thanks to Thin for your Silly Season Challenge – just what I need to get more motivated & mindfull at this time of year.
    Hope all those that have been unwell or had surgery are now feeling so much better. Thinking of you all & take time to heal!
    Hope you all have a wonderful weekend whatever you all choose to do – enjoy.
    Bye for now

    LJoyce, I haven’t had a white Christmas for many, many years. We rarely get snow here in the winter and when we do it usually melts within hours. But where I grew up, in the Midwestern US, we often had snow. It was pretty to look at but so cold! It’s still cold here in the winter but not usually freezing.

    Thin, I had been listening to Christmas music this weekend. And we got down a few boxes of decorations, but mostly I’ve been a total slug. My OH didn’t feel like getting the trees down which are up on a high shelf in the garage and it usually takes me going out there and starting to get them down myself before he gets involved. (He’s afraid I’ll drop them on his car. 😁). We have 2 tall ones for the entryway and family room and a smaller one for a table in the living room. But lately it seems like a lot of work getting everything up. I’m feeling lazy this year. I need to get motivated. Maybe someone can post their pictures and motivate both of us! I do like seeing the house decorated.

    Do you put up Christmas trees? I love all the colored lights, especially with the days getting so much shorter this time of year.

    Thin, your story about the crocodile books is hilarious. After watching Steve Irwin and Crocodile Dundee for so many years it’s funny that isn’t the first thing I think of about Australia.🐊 A BBQ for Turkey does make a lot more sense in the hot weather, LJoyce. I don’t even like turning the oven on to make pizza when it’s summer here. I have to look up Moreton Bay Bugs. I’ve never heard of those. What do they taste like?
    Some people have a tradition of whole Dungeness crab on Christmas Eve. They cover a table with newspapers and put out big bowls with crabs and shell crackers and forks and everyone makes a big mess at the table, opening them and eating. We were invited to someone’s house who did that one year. It was really fun but what a mess afterward, especially with young kids involved.

    We usually go to our niece’s house with the rest of OH’s family the day before Christmas to eat and celebrate, kind of an open house. My OH, sister and I used to go out to dinner on Christmas Eve, but in recent years we started going out the night before instead. I usually cook dinner on Christmas Day, either turkey or ham and all the trimmings. So it’s usually a big eating holiday. This year I will certainly do a FD the following day. And try to be more mindful during all the meals.

    What is Christmas pudding? It seems there are different recipes.

    Julie, I have been eating 500 calories on FDs all along. A quarter of my TDEE would be too hard for me to stick with. That’s only 345 calories. 500 calories already seems like almost nothing. Does anyone here really stick to 1/4 when their TDEE gets low?

    I almost always lose a kg or so on the 500 calories.

    Cali – this is pretty close to what my family call christmas pudding.
    http://www.delicious.com.au/recipes/christmas-pudding-vanilla-bean-custard/590d6e05-a731-4a2b-95b7-cc074248b7fd
    It’s a traditional British pudding – really dense, cakey and full of fruit and alcohol. You put it into a sheet of calico cloth, tie it up tightly, then boil for about 5 hours. To serve You pour brandy over the top and set it alight then serve it with lots of vanilla custard and cream. I’m not a fan, but then I don’t like dark fruit cake (christmas cake) either.

    Julie, I stated with 500cals as my FD limit, because 1/4 of my TDEE was 350 and it was too restrictive. Over time I’ve found I eat less on FDs and I’m mostly in the 350-400 range these days. If you can manage 1/4 of your TDEE that’s great, but what is most important is that you can stick with it, so if you need to be closer to 500 that’s ok. Better to do the FD on 500 than fail by trying to stick to a lower calorie limit.

    Thin, I think a slowing TDEE with age is the main reason people who’ve never had a weight problem suddenly wonder where the spare type came from in their 40s-50s. When I lost weight I was on such a restrictive diet that my TDEE was irrelevant (mostly 600-800cals, although I did a few months on 1000cals too). The calculations I gave on TDEE and percentages were based on the weight and age I was at the time – so I had adjusted for age.

    That all sounds like loads of fun CalifD. Yes, I do aim for 350 cals per FD but I keep a frozen banana or a boiled egg in reserve. As I’m in maintenance, I don’t worry if I get to 450 cals, or even 500 cals if my FD meal is one in the higher cal range. But, for JJulie, who’s struggling to lose weight despite putting in a lot of effort with FDs, I think it would be useful to her to pull out all the stops. And the less you eat, the less room for error in your calorie calculations!

    LJ, just read your latest and I do agree, whatever you can stick to is what you should do. I think one thing that helps is avoiding food for as long as possible on a FD. On occasions where I can’t get to food (NFDs), it absolutely doesn’t bother me one bit to go without. I’m quite smug about it.

    Yes, I realise your own calculations would have been meticulously adjusted for age at the time :lol:. I was just curious what the difference would have been in taking your original figures and working from there. JJulie, you get a smiley by writing a space, a colon, the letters lol and then another colon and another space.

    CalifD, My mum used to make Christmas Pudding for Christmas lunch. You start about three weeks before Christmas and soak the dried fruit in alcohol, usually brandy from memory. Then you make like a fruit cake but put the mixture into an unbleach piece of calico and tie it tightly at the top. You then boil it and when ready hang it up for about 2 weeks. On Christmas day you heat it by boiling again, take it out of the calico wrapping onto a large plate pour brandy over the top then set it alight. You serve with custard. It is something I have never liked as I dont like fruit cake/dried fruit at all.

    Sorry LJoyce, Your post was not there when I started my post!!! hehehe

    😆

    I did it!!!!

    Thin, I was trying to figure out why I had so much trouble loosing that bit more weight before I left for Japan.

    I was pleased that I only put on about .8 of a Kg the whole time. I did eat well, tried to make healthy choices when I could, kept away from fried foods that are comfort foods in Japan as the weather gets colder, although I had a drink or two I tried not to overdo it and I climbed mountains and walked miles and miles each day.

    So now I am back I really wanted to get into the weight loss arena again.

    I have only had the black coffee for breakfast this morning,
    I had the miso soup for lunch which ended up at 19 calories. So that is all I have had so far today.

    I am thinking of making an all egg white omlette with spinach and mushrooms for dinner. What do you think?

    You’re going very well today JJulie! Your dinner sounds perfect (I confess that I’d be having the yolk too). I’d still be compelled to work out the exact calories even with known low-cal ingredients such as those you’re using. For example, how will you cook that omelette? 😆 😆

    Thin,I worked out the calories to be 132 in total for the day in the Myfitnesspal program.

    I dont mind just the egg white in fact when I was young I would only eat the white of the eggs. I did not and still dont like the yolk.

    I cooked in a fry pan….I sprayed a little olive oil in the pan before I cooked the mushrooms then added 1/2 cup of the egg white to the pan and put the mushrooms on top. Of course it stuck a little so I made it into white scrambled egg with mushrooms spinach and a little sliced spring onion.

    I am feeling quite full now and I know I have some spare calories in case I get a bit picky later. I am going to try to keep below the 450 today. I still have to work out my TDEE for my goal weight yet.

    Just came across this list of Japanese grocery stores around the world, in case anyone is interested…..https://www.justonecookbook.com/japanese-grocery-stores-around-the-world/#Australia

    Jj and Lj, getting late and I can’t remember totally why in detail, but congratulations to both of you doing so well today👏🏼

    I remember Lj – getting under the weight you decided was Ok to stop at and a squeak above your original goal weight.

    Jj – great FD!

    I started 5:2 doing 500cals/FD and my TDEE on nonFDs. I gradually dropped my FD calories sticking to 1/4 of TDEE as my weight dropped over 2 yes to my goal weight. At goal weight 1/4 TDEE is 358cals. I have many days of FD and nonFD records where I counted every calorie through my lips. Not all the time but reasonably often. That helped me stop cals slowly creeping up over time. I particularly like to record cals on FDs.

    I’m an emotional eater, and I found that not eating till 6pm on a FD worked best for me.

    During this yukky year when I’ve been struggling with stress eating and trying to complete 2 FDs a week, I’ve upped my FD calories to 500 again. If that helps me get through this year, that’s fine with me. Next year I’m planning on going back to 360(358) cals/FD.

    CaliD – will post tomorrow about our Christmas.

    PS Australia’s best award winning plum pudding went winging it’s way, with some powdered custard, to California to be taken as our expat’s contribution to Thanksgiving Dinner. It is so rich only a small thin slice is needed.

    Would love a White Christmas… sigh..,,.

    CalifD, you asked about christmas trees. Yes we put up a christmas tree. I refuse to put the tree up before December though. Our tree is a lovely imitation fir tree with fairy lights and decorations. My family in Finland usually buys a real tree around the 22/23rd December and puts it up at the last minute with the decorations. Where we usually wrap our presents and put under the tree in readiness for the 25th, in Finland they usually have some outside activities on the 24th, like sparklers and making snowmen with the children while some of the adults sneek inside to put out the presents under the tree. When everyone goes back inside the children are surprised that Santa has been while they were playing. The 24th is the day it is celebrated in Finland. Australia celebrates on the 25th. We usually get up quite early and now with no small children we hand out gives in the morning. I then start getting the meats ready to roast, peeling vegies etc, while OH cleans up the lounge room of the wrapping paper then starts to set the table. We have a lot of friends up here that dont have family so they are invited to join us for lunch. We will greet them and have a drink before settling in to the meal which could go for quite some time. I usually do a traditional christmas lunch with roast lamb, roast pork, turkey breast (now only a small amount of turkey) and sliced ham off the bone. Vegies include potato, sweet potato, carrot, pumpkin, cauliflower/broccoli and peas and beans. Gravey for the meat, apple sauce for the pork, mint sauce for the lamb and cranberry sauce for the turkey. The cauliflower/broccoli usually has cheese sauce to put over it too.
    Dessert used to be christmas pudding but I too have now changed it to pavlova with fruits and OH likes apple pie with custard. After a good relax in the afternoon, and maybe a swim, we will put out the meats again as cold cuts and add some prawns with a coleslaw for salad. Hopefully we dont have too much left or we are eating it for days to come!!!

    Cinque that is good news although a tough experience. Hope your recuperation is relatively pain free and complete.
    We aren’t due to leave Bali til Friday but may go earlier. We can’t get flights anyway til the backlog is cleared. I feel for the Balinese people who rely so heavily
    on tourism.
    Merry thank you for the travel tips…. I can certainly try some. My husband is very supportive but does like company over meals and drinks particularly on holiday so that’s a challenge. But great advice, thank you

    Oh Lindsay, I thought you were stuck in Bali, not stuck here! I do hope you can get your holiday.
    And good luck working out how you can eat with your husband, without overeating.

    I was going to write another post yesterday about the (non) diet book article I posted, but unfortunately I made myself chicken and salad on toast for breakfast again, without realising the chicken had become dodgy, so I spent the rest of the day feeling very ill.

    And in the meantime, what a run of posts!

    I grew up with a very English Christmas: Roast meat, christmas pudding (with sixpences in it) mince pies, Father Christmases battling heat stroke in their outfits, pictures of snow and holly.
    When my daughter was little and I was very ill, Christmas was the worst day of the year for me as she was expecting it to be the best day of the year and I tried hard to make that happen, which always made me much sicker. Nightmare. But now she has her family it is a lovely day for me as I can just join in.

    Cinque, you are not having the best of times. Take care.

    Thinatlast, I will roast the goose, then roast the potatoes in the goose fat. There is no TDEE on Christmas Day.

    JustJulie. You still have Woolworths? UK Woolies went bust a couple of years ago. There used to be one in every reasonable sized town but they went very quickly. The buildings were sold off individually .

    LJoyce/Merryme. A white Christmas is fine, but unusual. The snow is early this year, we don’t normally see it until January. It is good to see when it comes, but after a few weeks we are usually glad enough to see it go. The longest I remember having it was three months, but that was in the north, in Teesdale.

    Properly stored, Christmas puddings last for ever. We have one that my daughter made a couple of years ago that may get used this year.

    Lindsay, my brain! You are in Bali. Enjoy!

    Well, I have reread the article https://www.sbs.com.au/food/article/2017/11/22/put-down-lettuce-leaf-theres-better-way-healthy-weight and looked up what the Set Point theory actually is, and found that there is also a Settling Point theory:

    Set Point Theory

    Set point theory hypothesizes that the body has an internal control mechanism, that is, a set point, located in the lateral hypothalamus of the brain, that regulates metabolism to maintain a certain level of body fat. Though evidence in rats has supported the theory, there is no scientific consensus that such a metabolic set point exists in humans for fat maintenance. Though weight losses after the use of stimulant drugs, nicotine, and exercise seem consistent with the concept of an altered set point, these effects can also be explained by the alteration of basal metabolism in ways that do not require a change in the set point. Studies using mainly dietary restriction have shown that weight loss is accompanied by a decrease in fat-free body mass and basal energy expenditure (Sum et al. 1994). Severe caloric restriction has been shown to depress resting metabolism by as much as 45% (McArdle, Katch, and Katch 1991).

    Settling Point Theory

    Interventions designed to alter diet and reduce weight have used principles of behavior therapy with modest success, particularly among the obese (Foreyt and Goodrich 1993). The most successful weight loss programs incorporate physical activity (Pavlou, Krey, and Steffee 1989; Perri et al. 1986). The settling point theory was proposed by obesity researcher James Hill of the University of Colorado to help explain why overweight and obesity are more than problems of metabolism (Hill, Pagliassotti, and Peters 1994). His idea is that weight loss and gain in most humans are more related to the patterns of diet and physical activity that people “settle” into as habits based on the interaction of their genetic dispositions, learning, and environmental cues to behavior. Evidence suggests that obese people are more sensitive to food-related stimuli in the social and physical environment, which influence their energy intake, than to the stimuli for energy expenditure.

    Back to me: I think that Dr Fuller’s Book has real integrity from the latest research and the experience of the obesity clinic, and it is definitely not a sensationalist book: slow,weight loss with lots of planning and changing habits is not the fad diet way!

    But I am like the rest of you and wondering about the theory behind it. I thought your criticisms were spot on LJoyce.

    I keep thinking about people who get hungry, eat, stop when they are satisfied, and don’t eat until they are hungry again. I think I ruined that mechanism in myself because of my youthful need for comfort eating, which turned into binge eating. On top of that I have a very strong response re sugar setting off the munchies.

    Sensible eating for me is very much a cognitive process. I am best if I plan mealtimes, portion sizes, everything about what I eat and when. I keep hoping that at some stage, eating a healthy amount will become natural again.

    I wonder if they have some sort of data collection option with people who try this weightloss technique to see how well it works?

    I think the techniques are sensible, I’d like to see results. And yes, it is so much easier with 5:2.

    Our Christmas is a little different as in we don’t have dinner with our whole family on the 25th.
    When my brother and sister got married they had to have Christmas lunch with their inlaws every year. It was not negotiable. My parents then went away for Christmas on holiday.
    We get together with my extended family on the weekend before Christmas and it is always at my house or my sisters. My sister has a lovely in-ground pool and it’s never a hot day when it’s her turn to host 😄 It usually is when it’s at my house 😩
    We do a roast lamb or a deep fried turkey (or both) cold chicken, ham and prawns and nice salads. Dessert is pavlova, cheesecake and fruit salad. There are 25 of us
    In my immediate family my DH is a policeman, my older DD a paramedic and my DDiL is a ED nurse. The chances of them all having Christmas Day off is slim so we get together a day or 2 b4 Christmas or Boxing Day. We have prawns for starters, deep fried turkey (if we didn’t have it with the extended family) and roast pork with roast potatoes, pumpkin, parsnip and beans and carrots, apple sauce, gravy and salads. My DD will make an amazing dessert and we’ll have a fruit salad. My DDinL has a lot of food intolerances so a we’ll have less desserts.
    DH makes Christmas cake but my own kids hate it, the inlaws love it.
    In the past DH and I have cooked on Christmas Day for a community, free lunch at our church. I’ve had a few prawns, champagne, strawberry and chocolate movie marathons with my DD and a good friend. Last year we had lunch on Christmas Day with my DD and her little family. Her DH will do a pork belly. But usually the actual day is a quiet one. 😀

    Cinque, thanks for your post. I’m a planner and plodder when it comes to food and weight loss. I, too, have to make cognitive decisions surrounding food. As I often say, I’m still the same person I was before 5:2 came into my life, it’s just that now I have the toolbox. Many of my issues surrounding food stem from my childhood and some responses and habits are hard to break.

    We still have Christmas pudding, soaked in brandy, set on fire, then served with lashings of home made brandy butter. Cinque, your family were wealthier than ours, we had a threepence in our puds!

    Penguin, I agree, there’s no TDEE on Christmas Day. A complete day of gluttony combined with sloth.

    JJulie, can I come to your place on Christmas Day? That was a very low intake yesterday – I hope you were rewarded handsomely on the scales this morning?

    Merry, you mention having counted every calorie that passes your lips, FD and NFD, at times. I’ve never eaten anything on a FD that wasn’t fully accounted for including herbal tea bags. So, when JJulie mentioned a spray of oil for her omelette, I was thinking ‘I wonder how many calories in that’. For how long would you hold down the nozzle?! I know I couldn’t trust myself to ‘wing it’ wrt calorie guessing. This became evident when LJ kindly computed my NFD calorie intake for me, something I had never done before. It wasn’t outrageous but a shock nonetheless. Surely, for FDs, we must count every single calorie when so few are allocated?

    Lindsay, enjoy the rest of your holiday.

    Stay, our posts crossed. I laughed about the temp being hotter when it’s your turn to host. That’s what I always joke about with our family friends. 42C when it’s my turn, 32C when it’s theirs! Please thank all your family members for working hard to keep our communities safe and well over the holiday period.

    Good morning everyone,

    I will just let you know my little bit of news first. Weight today was 78.6 so my FD yesterday worked as planned. I am going to do it all again today exactly the same!!

    Cinque, So sorry you weren’t feeling the best. After your op you dont need to have any food poisoning as well. Hope you are feeling better today and take care.
    You also mentioned sixpences in the Christmas pudding. I forgot about mentioning that in my last post. My mother would always put sixpences in her puddings. When decimal currency came in and we could not use the 5c pieces she had a stash of sixpences she kept for the christmas pudding. Then when people got a sixpence in their serve she would exchange it for a 5c piece so as to retain the sixpences. I still have them but dont use them anymore as I dont make the christmas pudding anymore.

    Pengiun, yes we have both Woolworths and Coles as our major supermarket chains. We also have IGA and some states still have Fooland. There are others around like Aldi and BiLo but we dont have them where I live. Cairns is very limited due to population so a trip to Brisbane/Sydney/Melbourne/Adelaide or Perth can be a big eyeopener and shopping spree for us. Although we would not bring back much in the way of food from the big cities, we do like the variety of clothing stores there.
    Having said that, I have on many occasions brought home Metwurst and Bung Fritz from my Adelaide trips along with some of the locally made chocolates.

    Stay, christmas 2015 we were in Japan, so we had Christmas lunch the weekend before. It worked out so good. There were still reasonably priced fruits and vegies and hams out for sale and prawns were still easy to get.

    I hear there could be a shortage of prawns this year so get in early. I will be getting ours next week and will put into the freezer in readiness.

    Catch again later in the day

    Thin, you posted while I was typing…..
    I did wonder how much would be in that spray of oil, but as I had a really low intake all round I was not too worried about it. It would be nice to know though for those days when you do need to count every single calorie as you are close to your daily amount.
    Do you think it would be better to put in say a measured amount of oil like a teaspoon, then brush it around the pan rather than using a spray?

    OK so you really got me thinking about it….

    The spray oil I used was ProChef Australian Canola spray. The back of the can says 2.5g is a serve and there are 120 serves in a can. 92 kj in a serve. Which google calculation says is 21.9885 calories or 22! I then had to find out how much 2.5g was in reality and it seems to be 1/2 a teaspoon. So I am pretty sure the amount I sprayed would not have been more than that.
    I also sprayed while the pan was cold as I thought that would give me a better indication on how much I had sprayed in case it was more difficult to determine if spraying onto a hot pan. Does that make sense?

    Jjulie – when I did weight watchers several decades ago we were told that a 2 second spray of oil was 70kj (17cal). I often make a (mostly) eggwhite omelette on FDs too and I also find that cooking the mushrooms first makes the omelette stick. The only way I avoid it it to wash the pan in between – usually too much work. I often add 1tblsp parmesan cheese to the omelette – it’s 135kj (32cal). For the amount of calories it adds a lot of flavour.

    Thanks LJoyce, I am going to have the same for dinner tonight and happen to have some parmesan in the fridge. That sounds like a great flavour addition without too many calories.

    I bought the carton of all egg whites from the supermarket yesterday. It is so much easier and less wasteful than separating an egg like I used to do.

    Still here in Bali and enjoying our break after what has been a tough old year. Not sure when we’ll get home, but as long as it’s in time to buy a turkey, that’s okay! Merry it would be so easy to put on weight here just with the drinks, so I’m mostly following your tip about drinking tea and water. The juices here are amazing – mango, pineapple papaya etc. My husband had a banana juice with his breakfast yesterday and he loved it. (He eats and drinks what he likes and never budges past 72 kilos). I stuck with my black coffee – which fortunately is my drink of choice anyway. Confession time….I did have a margarita last night, but only one, and I asked them for pure lime juice and salt (often here they use lime syrup and sugar on the rim of the glass).
    Julie tough, not having laundry facilities while you’re away. Hotels charge so much. I am always a bit wary too, after putting a size 16 skirt into one hotel laundry, and getting it back shrunk to about a size 12. BTW with oil, I tip in half a teaspoon, then wipe it around with a tissue. The residual film of oil seems to do the trick, and I doubt there’d be a quarter of a teaspoon left.

    Lindsay, I love a home made margarita made the proper way. Can’t deal with those syrupy things.

    JJulie, I wasn’t trying to do your head in! If using oil, I think you’d be better off using the spray – and of course LJ would know exactly how long to depress the nozzle to get a specific calorie count! I was really just making the point that I couldn’t trust myself with a spray of oil here and a splash of milk there because I know I would under-estimate it. Plus I’d likely lose count of how many bits and pieces I’d added during the fast day which is exactly what happens on a NFD. Unbridled eating.

    I’ve never made an omelette on a FD for that reason but I have a single egg cooked in a variety of ways – poached in water on the stove, poached in the microwave, soft boiled or scrambled omelette style in a tiny, non-stick pan with no oil. I find one egg or one banana the two most satiating foods around. As our bananas seem to ripen so quickly, I often freeze them and this makes a fabulous FD evening treat. Eaten at a snail’s pace, savouring every icy bite!

    Perhaps I’m too pedantic? On the other hand, you had a good result with yesterday’s careful effort. I initially collected a good range of FD ‘meal’ recipes but I tend to stick to the same things with very few ingredients and I haven’t needed to count the calories for a couple of years. Calorie counting is a real chore for me. Fortunately, we have LJ here.

    I’m having to pull my first FD for next week into the end of this one due scheduling difficulties early next week. So I’m fasting today instead of tomorrow. I have a lunch to go to on Monday and an afternoon tea on Wednesday. I plan to fast again on Tuesday. This schedule will give me 2 NFDs between FDs, which is always more successful for me.

    I’m already onto my second pot of tea as I had to be up early to get to a dietitian appointment this morning. I have a very small grilled fillet steak and a few toasted pine nuts left over from Thursday night so I thought I’d make a spinach salad with the sliced beef, tomatoes and cucumber and a garnish of pine nuts for my FD dinner tonight – a bit of a change from my usual FD fare. The planning failed me on lining up meals with climate. It’s 16C here today (3 days ago it was 34C), so not really salad weather today. I suppose I can warm the beef and pine nuts and make it a warm salad – that actually sounds more inviting.

    My dietitian and I have agreed on a 3-4 month cycle of appointments next year as I need less support these days. She said that I seem calmer and have more self confidence than I did a year ago. I would agree with that. A year ago I felt panic about keeping my weight stable and my only tool was to increase the monitoring and try to exert really rigid control over everything – usually resulting in break-out binge eating.

    I discussed the shortbread episode with her and my strategy for getting through the rest of the christmas baking. I also said that my solution doesn’t address the issue of me having difficulty walking away from a treat food without eating it. She said that I needed to consider that indulgence and restraint were a normal part of eating for me and rather than thinking I still needed to change that, perhaps I just needed to know that I can to manage it – in other words accept myself as I am, instead of thinking it’s faulty and needs to be changed. Especially now that I’m not having all out binge days any more, just a bit of occasional excess. That’s a new idea for me that I hadn’t considered. And I know I do have strategies these days that manage the behaviour. Perhaps a bit of excess is followed by a FD and is fine.
    Something else we discussed is the level of monitoring and control I used to try and exert over my diet. She said that that level of monitoring was never going to be a helpful strategy for me because of the way I react to seeing my weight on the scales (an increase almost invariably led to a binge, especially if I knew didn’t deserve the weight gain). I definitely know this is true for me and I also know that even without all the monitoring my weight has been stable or declining, so it’s proved to me that I don’t need to do it and I definitely feel calmer without it. Oddly I don’t feel like I’m less in control without it, which is the reverse of what I would have expected.

    The other thing I discussed with both the dietitian and my physio is including some sessions with an exercise physiologist. The conclusion is that I will have 2-3 session next year to focus on building strength as that is my weak point. The dietitan said that it may also help my rather slow metabolism. I won’t hold me breath on that outcome, but having better muscle stamina would be helpful. At the end of a couple of hours of hard gardening I’m not puffing but my body feel physically exhausted. I’ve decided to start the sessions with the exercise physiologist after I move house as I will be able to focus on them then. I will also need a new routine once I don’t have 1/3 acre of gardens to look after anymore.

    I feel reassured knowing I have a rough plan in place for next year that will give me the support to help me stay healthy.

    I hope you all have nice plans for the weekend.

    Thin – just because I don’t count my own calories anymore doesn’t mean I can erase all that knowledge from my brain – it’s all still there. As I’m reminded every time someone asks a calorie related question.

    A lovely conclusion to a year well practiced LJ. You should be very proud of yourself. And feasting is important as well as fasting.

    LindsayL, I usually wash out the underwear at night cause it is dry in the morning, but this time I was also washing my heat tech clothing by hand. Thank goodness they too dry quickly. My daughter however did have some problems as she is a clean clothes freak. Just will not wear something twice even if it has only been worn for an hour before. But she is old enough to do her own washing these days and she made good use of one afternoon in our hotel just doing her washing. OH on the other hand is not too interested in washing his but I refuse to do his as well now so he has to do his own!!

    Thin,no problem, you did not really do my head in, but it did remind me that I had not counted that oil spray in the end and while spraying I was asking myself “how am I going to work out the calories in this?” It was a good exercise for me to find out. And really I am a person who likes to keep a record of everything I put into my mouth. I am a planner as you have probably realised with my overseas trips. I have everyday planned before I leave. I think I would have done well in the army or something similar as I love rules and direction and adhere to them with passion. I was never a person to “step out of line” or “push the buttons”.

    Thank you LJoyce for your wealth of information about calories that you constantly share with us all.
    Thank you Thin for your wealth of information on how to make 5:2 work and your own successful experience that you willingly hand on to others.
    Thank you to everyone who helps on this forum in which ever way you do, we each have something worthwhile to share.

    And I am glad Thin is always reminding me that feasting is just as important as fasting. It helps me keep on track too.

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