Fasting when you really really love food

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Fasting when you really really love food

This topic contains 41 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  annette52 5 years, 7 months ago.

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  • I am wondering if fasting is improving your relationship with food. I tried to gas the other day and felt quite flat during the day. I usually look forward to every meal and snack- something I could get away with before turning forty, now not so much.

    It’s not junk food I eat so much it’s just overeating. I am seeking a way of pemanently curbing that appetite, I’m a compulsive eater – lay a basket of bread in front of me or a bowl of cherries and I can happily munch my way through a lot! So if you would kindly share of there is anyone who has seen improvements for compulsive/ hedonic. Eaters?

    Hi DG,

    From what you are saying you don’t eat because you are hungry. Is that a fair comment? Certain foods release dopamine (feel good hormone) and the two foods you mention contain a lot of sugar. Bread is turned into maltose in your mouth (two glucose rings joined together), it is then turned into glucose shortly after leaving your stomach. Lots will argue otherwise but I consider bread to be junk food. Cherries contain fructose (and glucose) once again it will release dopamine. Add insult to injury fructose inhibits lepton signalling (tells your brain you don’t need to eat anymore).

    No easy solution, you will have a hard time of it for about 1-2 months. Fasting coupled with eating whole foods (bread is not a whole food, its highly processed!!) will help establish a better relationship with your food. Being at ease with fasting will probably take about 6 months. Does fasting coupled with eating whole unprocessed foods work? Absolutely, it really boils down to you.

    Just trying to give you a realistic picture. I went from 202 down to 154 lbs. Been in maintenance about 3 years now

    BB that’s a useful insight. I’m a carb fiend, I have tried low carb for health reasons in the past but felt nauseous, a lot, but that may have also been because I upped my coffee intake. It’s great of you to share, interesting you saying how carbs are broken down in the mouth too. I definitely get a bit of a high from the foods you mention. Moderation with those foods are my weakness. I do naturally have a huge appetite too. I will try removing the processed foods, which actually if you consider bread, pizza (I have healthy pizzas with salad, to me they’re healthy- deluding myself?) and cereals are all processed to some degree despite not having additional sugar added.
    I thought about booking on a fasting retreat to get myself started. Food is such a huge part of my every day life, meals and snacks have become some what of a habit but I do not always eat for hunger, often pleasure I must admit. Small portions don’t do it for me either so I’m going to have to reconsider my whole attitude. As mentioned wasn’t a problem until I hit 40. Damn.
    Well done on you weight loss and sustaining! This is really motivating thank you, and hearing that it was tough for you is also helpful.

    Hi DG,
    Yes I consider bread, pasta, pizza, biscuits , cookies, cakes, breakfast cereals all highly processed junk. They are treat foods, to be had maybe once per week. Your liver is supposed to act as a two way processing centre. It takes excess carbs and stores then as glycogen and then fat. When glucose levels are low it takes stored fats and turns it into glucose and ketones (fat burning). It is this second action that the liver becomes very lazy at doing. Like any other organ or muscle it becomes inefficient if you don’t exercise it. I just went cold turkey when I decided to try fasting, I still do it every Monday but not for weight loss anymore. Try cold turkey see if you can do it. Or try it gradually see if it works. Try skipping breakfast and see if you can make it to lunch. Or it you cant manage that try a low carb breakfast. Bacon and eggs. No bread or cereals. No fruit juice!!!! Pure junk. You want fruit eat a whole apple.

    Good luck with it.

    Bacon and eggs? Well the eggs can be good but bacon is something that should only be eaten in limited amounts unless you are trying to get cancer. It is a highly processed food and chuck full of nitrates.

    There are actually good reasons to eat a breakfast as insulin sensitivity tends to be higher in the more than the evening. One food I enjoy that takes a bit of getting used to is oatmeal (made from just rolled oats) sweetened with blueberries. I tend to use a lot of other fruit but the blueberries tend to make the oatmeal even more filling. I typically use 100g of rolled oats which makes a good sized bowl. 100g of both oatmeal and blueberries would be around 400 calories but it is possible it will keep to too full to want to eat for a while.

    Then if you have something to keep yourself busy too, that should help.

    Finally just make it hard to eat so you have time to talk yourself out of it.

    One should be careful with refined carbs, that I can agree with. I just disagree that going from one extreme to another is okay. Most people like bacon, but bacon is probably just as bad for a person as white bread. Just trading one set of bad problems for another. Once in while it should be fine, everyday though is asking for problems. It might work well for losing weight for some people, but please don’t consider it a healthy alterative.

    I guess what my real concern is processed food. Bacon is a processed food containing a lot of nitrates. Modern white bread is also just a processed food, refined flower and even HFCS. I don’t see the point of trading one process food for another.

    Another point is I can easily eat 5 rashes of bacon, ~250 calories worth. I doubt I could eat 250 calories of dark greens or even 250 calories of apples in one setting. While I don’t really believe the calories are the most important thing, at some point they would really matter. I know some people fine that greasy foods are very filling and that helps then eat less, I’m just not one of them. 🙁

    I don’t know about bacon, I’m just finding all food a challenge, it’s usually not fatty food as such, just carbs. When I’m at home with poorly child and having gained weight recently I felt disheartened, I find even the most mundane foods appealing and could snack all day long.
    I hate to sound negative and hoping I can be inspired but I find losing weight really tough, as soon as I reduce the amount I eat I just want food even more. I haven’t stuck with the fasting approach yet though. Funny how fasting was always considered something to avoid as could cause/aggravate an ED (I’m sure it can in some btw) but actually every day eating is disordered for me, there is food available everywhere and it’s v challenging to avoid it if you like it, like me. I opened the fridge today and saw a [pile of cheese and biscuits from the previous day) and just started picking and eating, I had to talk to myself and then my mind was like “leave me a lone I’m munching noooone can stop me”! Does anyone know of any daily support groups I don’t know anyone else who is fasting and it would be nice to be with a group (I know there are those on here and you have been great but I can’t post on here every day:-)). My family have a history of alzheimer’s so there is more than the aesthetic on my mind. I read somewhere about a US military man McChrystal? who said he would get up and run and would avoid eating during the day as lacked discipline. I admired his honesty and his “just get on with it approach”. I think it’s going to take quite a few stabs at this to get it right for me.

    Maybe you need to approach this in stages. Start with no snacks, just 3 meals a day. if you drink fizzy(soda) then that is your number 1 enemy.

    Jason Fung ‘The Obesity Myth’ would view your description of reducing the amount that you eat with the desire to eat more as a natural response from your brain. The notion that our bodies have a set weight that is decreed by the brain and that when you try to change that, you are driven to eat more. He sees obesity has a multifactorial disease so it is important to reduce stress, get plenty of sleep as well as looking at what we eat and meal timing.

    Fung regards obesity as a hormonal disorder of fat regulation. Insulin is the major hormone that drives weight gain, so it is logical to aim to reduce the levels of insulin. All foods raise insulin but refined grains stimulate insulin production more than virtually any other food so avoid bread, cakes, pasta, noodles etc. Avoid fake food(replacement shakes and bars for example).

    Fung believes that it is important to make sure that there is an increase in food with fibre, so eat fruit, berries, nuts, pumpkin seeds, flax seeds and vegetables. He also thinks that it is important to consume natural fats such as olive oil, butter, full fat dairy products and avocados.

    There are 2 factors that maintain a high insulin level-what we eat and meal timing. Constant grazing will keep levels of insulin high. So by eating 3 meals and no snacking, insulin levels can fall between meals. Fasting for 6 hours allows insulin levels to drop and he advocates fasting between 24-36 hours.

    I realise that this is quite a lot to take on board. Start with cutting out the snacking and changing what you eat at meal times. Avoid anything diet or low fat(full of sugar) and eat ‘real’ food. You will feel fuller for longer eating fruit and vegetables with meat or fish or beans.

    I usually eat an evening meal, then skip breakfast the next day as a fast day and then eat lunch and dinner. It does get easier and you may find it far easier than you think that you will.

    Look, I am a weakling when it comes to food and drink and have to be really mentally strong to get through a 5:2 day. I was recently given a present of a bottle of PENDERYN Welsh Single Malt whisky with a Madeira finish. Welsh Whisky for goodness sake, who would have thought it?. Yes I know the Japanese make whisky and Sean Connery has even advertised it. (Shame on you). I have to say that this Penderyn is very good and yes, every sip I took made me feel guilty about the calories I was putting on. The good news!!! is that I have just finished the last of the bottle so back to sparkling water for me.

    Delayedgratification you have been given some good advice and you have taken the hardest step, admitting you have an issue. I was obese for years before I could even admit I was obese. Really crazy but it was very hard for me to accept the truth.

    Hi DG,

    Ok none of us are psychologists and what you’ve said so far indicates that you are not consuming food as a source of nutrition. Its for “other” reasons. For me it was simple, I didn’t know what healthy food was. Did some research came to my own conclusions, started eating “my healthy foods” and the weight came off and has stayed off. But what you are saying doesn’t fall into this category. So what is your worst “poison food”? Cookies, ice cream, chocolate? Bite the bullet and don’t buy those foods any more. Don’t have them in the house. As a family unit we bit the bullet and stopped buying biscuits/cookies. The kids whinged at first but now they don’t miss them at all. So get rid of your biggest comfort food and replace it with apples, or carrots or whatever. Just make it healthy.

    Try Becky, she explains things in a simple manner and has a method where you eliminate one bad food but you must replace it with one good food.

    You may not be psychologists, there is nothing more valuable than personal experience with success stories and this provides you with the skills to offer insight. Personal observations of myself are I want to have a balanced diet without being faddy, when I start eating (I like it) I want to carry on. Full stop and I do use food for comfort. I need to change this it’s either accepting sometimes I have to not use anything to cheer myself up or go for that walk (can I go for a walk everytime I want to ea??). Bigbooty I watched the video, interesting the doctor advocates keto diet as well as fasting. Dykask I am presuming you aren’t obese any more?
    Bigbooty my poison is actually quite what some would deem as “healthy foods” wholegrain cereals and bread with no added sugar, I just have some, then want more. I’m sure I would munch on biscuits too but I don’t keep them in the house usually and that’s acceptable for others, I will buy a small pack for occasions or we will have a slice when out and about. I find mornings, mid morning and 3pm my most challenging times. When I wake up I’m the type that looks forward to breakfast and coffee and half an an hour later I’m looking for another slice of toast with avocado or butter (it may be wholegrain). Admittedly all have a carbohydrate base, but will serve with protein (cheese) and I used to have nut butters (protein) but I just can’t be disciplined with so I try to avoid them. In fact I almost fear the day without breakfast and snacks! So there is an element of emotional eating at play, but I have noticed it’s much, much worse since turning 40 whether that’s coincidence I’m not sure. There also feels like a freedom of trying fasting as it’s annoying wanted more snacks all the time. It’s distracting. I think dykask your approach of avoiding all food appeals as when I start eating it seems to set off my appetite. I would need something before bed though. I’m like my friend’s pet dog always scavenging…I’m also curious as t what effect fasting has had on your mood…? Thank you for your really kind support.

    There is a book by Jason Fung that really helped me called The Complete Guide to Fasting. Very easy to read, I borrowed it from the library after it was recommended, but I am going to buy my own as a reference book (for the dark days!)

    Hi DG,

    Its hard to know if your addiction to carbs is chemically driven or psychologically driven? I personally think that all grain based foods (including rice) are junk. A lot of people disagree and that’s fine. For me I try and limit their intake to an absolute minimum. I never have rice or pasta anymore and I might have a serve of cake once a month, usually because its someone’s birthday. I always tend to regret it as quite often I end up with a headache. The difference between bread and sugar is absolutely minimal. Both have been turned into glucose by the time it just leaves your stomach.

    With regards to diet, I don’t follow any diet. What I eat doesn’t really fit into any “name” diet. The closest would be plant based whole foods. I do eat meat but not a lot. Im not really low carb but the vast majority of my carbs comes from veg and some fruit. Mostly apples and berries. Apricots and dates as well for a treat. I eat lots of cheese, beans and my go to snack is almonds. I love all kinds of nuts.

    Cant say my mood changes while fasting. No one at work has commented that I act any different. I fast every Monday. When I first started fasting all I could think of was food and how I would “devour” a meal after my fast. Only to find that I really wasn’t eating that much after a fast. I don’t really think about food when I fast now. But Ive been doing this for over 3 years now. Its hard describe but when I first started fasting it was almost like an out of body experience. Like I was walking around in a bubble and the world was “out there somewhere”. I don’t really get that sensation any more. I do get a slight sense of agitation but it is very mild. Im not sure what hormone is responsible for that feeling but I suspect its a normal response to not eating. My body trying to tell me that something is amiss.

    Hi DG,
    If I was going to save you from all of the mistakes that I have made it would be, in no particular order, stop adding sugar to hot drinks(I gave up after 40+ years), give up added sugar(usually means shop bought breakfast cereals, jar tomato sauce, fruit yoghurts, anything low fat/diet), stop snacking(3 meals a day but make breakfast optional), don’t celebrate a FD with an Almond Croissant(just treat it as an ordinary day-its noting special, a third of the worlds population is supposed to last throughout their lives(Fung), eat whole unprocessed food.

    Take a look at Jason Fung The Obesity Myth. He states that Obesity is a hormonal disorder of fat regulation and that Insulin is the major hormone that drives weight gain. He also argues that refined grains(bread/pasta/noodles/wraps/cakes etc) stimulate insulin production more than virtually any food. It makes sense to avoid them and after some gentle encouragement from bigbooty, I did. I wondered what on earth I was going to eat(fussy, not a fan of vegetables). I then tried rice and pasta separately and found that I felt so sleepy(sugar crash) so now I rarely have them and I feel better.

    I actually eat meat/fish with salad or raw vegetables, cheese, eggs, nuts, full fat milk, full fat yoghurt, fruit, avocados. I make hummus-very easy. Instead of spreading things on bread, I eat whole food with cutlery. Its really easy.

    Fung argues that long term weight loss is dependant on 2 factors-what we eat and meal timing. To break insulin resistance-fast. I have just finished a 24 hour fast-ate dinner last night, skipped breakfast and lunch and broke my fast with a pile of cherry tomatoes/cole slaw and prawns, followed by a banana and some fresh apricots. I will eat nothing else, sleep and then have breakfast tomorrow.

    The reason that you are hungry and snacking is those beige carbs-ditch them and swop them for a handful of nuts or a banana. Nothing else.

    I have come a long way from that round little person that thought that she would collapse in a heap if she didn’t eat for half and hour, used to hide food, felt rubbish and completely fed up with my shape and size. There is 3 stone less of me, I have a waist, 3 dress sizes smaller, love new clothes, my knees don’t hurt going up stairs and I am not breathless or really slow going up hill.

    I haven’t noticed any difference in my mood and the family isn’t telling me that I am grumpy. I was really worried that I wouldn’t be able to do any fasting but we are all designed to fast, its not nearly as bad as you think it is going to be. I also found that I felt so much better on a FD that I started to change what I ate on a NFD.

    DG- I completely understand where you’re coming from, I’d got into a habit of snacking a lot & eating bigger meals too, definitely eating for pleasure, so had put on a couple of stone… I find it easier not to eat during the day on FDs as opposed to little meals, try to distract myself by keeping busy, fasting days when I’m going to be out etc. Walking or a quick HIIT session (there’s beginners 10 mins ones on youtube), & lots of water through the day helped. Tell yourself you can wait until tomorrow for whatever it is you think you want, & hopefully by then whatever it is the need will have faded… I did alternate fast days too as 2 days fasting didn’t help shift the weight for me, I did like the routine of that, but it was hard. But then we had a stressful time, & I was getting into a feasting/ fasting mode, eating too much chocolate, cakes, biscuits, & was barely maintaining let alone losing, so I tried keto (high fat, low carb)- that’s helped me lose some more along with fasting & has really decreased my carb cravings! If carbs are your downfall I’d consider it; it’s hard at first but there are so many higher fat things I can eat now- cheese, salad dressings, nuts, avocados, cream in coffee I’m really enjoying it, am more full so don’t need to snack, fasting is easier…
    But if I can do it, any one can!

    Really really useful and helpful posts, thank you.

    I am finding giving up breakfast hard. I have a few milky coffees upon wakening. I posted about this a few weeks ago but the day I didn’t have breakfast it was easier to stick to nil intake until lunch/late afternoon.

    I struggle with mornings, I’m often grumpy and my creamy coffees and luxury breakfast is what helps me to face the day (like most people I don’t love going to work!). If I could somehow distract myself with something enjoyable whilst I make the others brekkie. It’s difficult as time is limited in the am – but enough time for me to manage great coffee consumption and eat a big breakfast. It isn’t hunger it’s just a desire to lift my morning mood with food. We get up early and then of course two hours later I’m ready for lunch. A challenge.

    On the plus side I am super organised, get the whole family ready and am ready for work by 7am…

    So give up lunch instead of breakfast if you must have breakfast. Or Dinner? If youre not ready to reduce any one of those three meals then you may not be ready to start youre journey. I place a lot more importance on what you eat rather than how much you eat. But that’s me. So what exactly is a luxury breakfast? If youre hungry two hours later I suspect it consists of a lot of refined carbs. Only you can start youre journey. Good luck.

    It sounds like you want all of the benefits without making any changes DG. The bottom line is this, if you want to stay the same then change nothing. If you want to change how you are, then be the change and make the change.

    I thought that I was going to collapse in a heap without breakfast and used to think that I was such a martyr for missing breakfast twice a week. Not very impressive when a third of the globe fast regularly throughout their adult life is it?

    I also used to cook from scratch for 4 teenage boys who were always hungry and as my food knowledge improved, I made changes to what they ate too. Out went the fruit yoghurts/chocolate mousse and in went more fruit. Out went pudding on a Sunday when we realised that we didn’t need it. Out went the jar sauces and in came homemade tomato sauce.

    Change the quality of the food that you all consume. This isn’t a diet but a way of life. If you must have breakfast every day then have scrambled eggs with smoked salmon.

    If you want to be different then you will have to make a change. Simple.

    When I started fasting it was by skipping snacks/supper. I didn’t want to give up breakfast and it turns out skipping supper is probably healthier. However, it is sometimes a real social problem.

    After some number of fasts, I noticed I didn’t like being overfull so much. That helped curbed my overeating. Sometimes I still overeat like this last weekend, but now my overeating is a fraction of what it used to be.

    Avoiding added refined sugar also helps a lot. We I do have refined sugars I notice I will eat a lot more and feel driven to eat.

    I think Annette summed it up pretty well. Change nothing and nothing will change. When you are ready to start your journey you’ll find 10 reasons why you started. If your not ready you’ll find 10 reasons not to start. Good luck with your journey, lots of people with good info on this site.

    Tough love and great advice. I think I like sticking my head in the sand and being in the comfort zone- I like the idea of fasting and potential benefits, now getting my head round some sacrifice. Thank you for your thoughtful (and honest) posts. Hunger can be challenging.

    Ps hoping I’ll feel amazing. The long shot if it is it’s for healthy but short term change seems like a steep
    Mountain to climb.

    Have really enjoyed reading all your posts. I only joined the forum yesterday. Today was my first fast day. To my surprise, it was not so hard, my problem is lunch, all my colleagues go together and I used too as well. Not that I was that hungry. Just a habit. Nothing more, nothing less, a habit.

    Relationship with food is complex. I’ve tried many diets but the science is simple. Too many calories, especially certain simple carbohydrates or fats, and you know the rest. But no matter what excuses we make, there is always a choice, although may be difficult at the time, the choice is there. Nonone is forcing us to eat. We chose.

    By reading the many inspirational stories on this forum, I am determined to be one of the success stories. Like other things in life, amazing what we can achieve if we put our mind to it.

    DG-we didn’t make lots of changes all at the same time, it has been gradual and we have tried different things out. If I can fast…anyone can, even you.

    I thought that the 5:2 would never work for me and that I was a lost cause. I started a FD by missing breakfast and then having a tin of mushroom soup for lunch(200 cals) and I was miserable eating it without a lovely hunk of bread. I managed to eat fish and vegetables to finish the day. I was rigid on the 500 cals to prove that it wasn’t going to work.

    The scales didn’t seem to move much, but in 8 months I had lost 26lb and 26 inches= 3 dress sizes smaller. I realised that I felt much better on FD so I started to change what I ate on NFD. I used to eat muesli, then started making my own with sultanas, raisins, apricots and dates. One day I decided to work out the sugar content and was shocked how much I was consuming, so I changed it to pumpkin seeds, sunflower seeds, linseed, almonds and jumbo porridge oats.

    I found it useful to read labels on everything and kept below 24g sugar/day-WHO guidelines. It was shocking how much sugar is hidden in lots of food. Information is power.

    The breakfast that you eat, how much sugar is in it? Start making healthy swaps. See how you feel and how your clothes fit?

    You can do it, we are here with tough love!

    @purplevilet – Welcome!

    @delayedgratification – Changes can be scary but sometimes after you make them you find what you were doing was harder. For example the change that really started turning things around for me was greatly reducing my refined sugar consumption. The first step was giving up a daily ice cream bar that I really liked. I had even worked it into a calorie restrictive diet. I gave it up for a few weeks and then noticed my constant hunger was pretty much gone. I felt so much better without the hunger I cut more sugar and over a period of four months I lost 6kg. I was even eating more food in terms of calories because I started replace sweets with nuts and cheese. Before the change I couldn’t lose weight and I was gaining fat. After getting my refined sugar consumption down I was eating more food and losing fat. A side effect is I really felt much better too. Scary change but I’m happy I made it and right now I wouldn’t go back. The way I eat now is much better and more enjoyable. My tastes have also changed a lot.

    So just make a change and see what happens. There worst thing is you go back to where you already are.

    DG as the add says, Just Do It. Pick one thing that you can improve. Whats your worst “poison”? Is it having 3 teaspoons of sugar in your coffee? Is it that cake or muffin at morning tea? Is it desert after every meal? Whatever it is just ditch it and hang tough for a few weeks. Sugar addiction usually takes about 1 month to get rid of. Its tough but hell its not THAT hard. There a people all over the world that don’t have enough food to feed their families. That’s HARD. Getting rid of sugar in your coffee, that’s got to be do-able? Surely? So pick one poison and ditch it. So tomorrow post on here and say that you did without X-food for a day. Then you made it through two days without X-food. Then a week. Come on DG just do it and then come on here and tell everyone. you’ll be amazed at the responses.

    @pv. Way to go. Lets hope that your success will help DG jump on board.

    Ok yesterday I didn’t skip breakfast (milky coffee and protein breakfast) but I did have two apples for lunch ( isee that as no lunch) then dinner of fish with vegetables and a high protein yoghurt for dessert, no bread (shock, horror)… for me that’s progress… Sunday I plan to skip breakfast…

    Great inspiration on here – than you!

    Way to go DG. No bread!! Your body will be thanking you. 🙂 Apples so lots of soluble and insoluble fibre (make sure apples aren’t peeled).

    Wow DG! No bread-very impressive.

    I rarely eat bread now and I don’t miss it, which goes for pasta, rice and potatoes too. I feel so much better without them on a daily basis.

    So, I don’t know if this is valuable for you. I have a complicated relationship with carb based foods. If I were left to my own devices I could probably eat nothing but fat and carbs forever.. But I’ve been reading that some of that may be stress triggered. Knowing that, for some reason helps. I mean I can’t tell you why knowing that would make a difference, but there you are.

    I don’t like carbs less, I just feel less compelled by them.

    Instead of avoiding carbs, which I enjoy, (and life is short and why not eat some damn cake every now and then for goodness sake) I try to just make sure that I’m eating a healthy proportion of carbs. For a while I was trying to do one third carbs one third protein and one third fat. The truth is I just couldn’t cram in that much protein (and fat can be a struggle too.) I mean what are you supposed to do at 8 at night when you still need to eat a bazillion grams of protein? Mainline liver? Now I’m trying to eat 24% protein and that’s a lot more sustainable.

    I um… also started taking antidepressants. It took about six months, but it’s really improved my relationship with food. Now, I’m not recommending welbutrin as a weight loss tool. I mean I started taking them because I was depressed and a doctor thought I should. But sometimes that’s a component in the happy carb merry go round.

    Oh, and I’m just naturally getting most of my carbs from healthier sources. I haven’t scratched anything off the board and if I’m going out for dinner, if I’m going to a party, if I just really want frozen yogurt, I have it.

    But as a function of eating healthier, on a day to day basis, I’m choosing the thing I like with the biggest nutritional bang for the buck.

    My carbs come from fruit and vegetables in the main. Nothing is banned but as time ticks on I find that I want the cakes less and less because I feel better without. I cannot be bothered to look at the proportion of what I eat in terms of protein/fat/carbs because I think it is important to consume good fat in terms of butter, eggs, cheese, full fat yoghurt and milk, nuts and avocados. I like fish and meat, so eat them regularly simply cooked with unprocessed fruit and vegetables. Anything that comes in a box is something that I rarely eat.

    If anti depressants help then that is great. I find that my mood is better with a combination of out walking every day(I don’t have a car so walk 45 mins each way to work in wind/rain/sun). I also find that eating simple food makes me feel better, but the pasta/rice makes me feel sluggish and tired.

    Yeah, the antidepressants have been life changing. For most of my adult life I viewed depression as a thing people could decide to get over. I thought it was irresponsible of doctors to keep throwing pills at things. (I still think there’s too much medicating going on.) But I’ve also struggled with unhappiness al my life. Persistant unhappiness. Diet and exercise helped, but never fixed the problem.

    So, yeah, I’m really glad I decided to get past my biases and try them. On the other hand.

    And I’ve decided not to be embarrassed about it 🙂

    Depression is nothing to be embarrassed about and it isn’t something that you can choose to have or not, rather like a broken limb or chronic disease. If we had a choice, we would all be as fit and healthy as was humanly possible, but the best that we can do is make the most of what we have and do anything that helps.

    My son had severe depression and failed his first year at university when he came home a complete shell, a fragile gaunt desperately unhappy young man. The plus was that he was very compliant and trusted me to do what was best for him. He tried a whole range of antidepressants until we found the right ones/dosage for him. He also had ‘talking therapy’ which has been very helpful. Exercise helps to lift his mood and he cooks nutritious food for himself too. He is much better and with support seems to be flourishing without the antidepressants but counselling.

    I think that mental health is where cancer was 5 years ago in terms of people being open and talking about it. If you find the antidepressants helpful then that is great, but look at talking therapies too. There is no harm in eating food that nourish both body and soul , as well as getting out and about in the sunshine.

    Thank you Annette. Yeah, I do talk therapy intermittently. When I feel like I need it. Sometimes I get to a point where I go in for a session and we can’t find anything to talk about. That’s a great time for a break.

    But I feel like I highjacked this post! Anyway, I think carbs aren’t inherently evil. They’re just sometimes tricky.

    Have any of you seen ‘The truth about carbs?’ a BBC programme. Very interesting. I had no idea that the sugar from a baked potato could equate to 19 sugar cubes which may convert to fat if not used.

    A GP selected patient volunteers who were overweight or had type 2 diabetics. He wanted to see what carbs affected blood sugar(they were wearing monitors). Aim for porridge or eggs. Swop beige(biscuits/cakes) and white carbs(rice/pasta/white bread) for green carbs(fruit/vegetables).

    Being clever with carbs can also reduce bowel cancer which is linked with obesity. Eat more foods high in fibre. Also the effects of white/beige carbs on infertility and impact on the next generation. Fascinating.

    Low carb volunteers after 2 weeks-didn’t struggle, reduced weight(7LB EACH) and waistlines, diabetics-blood sugar control was improved and on the way to reversing their diabetes!

    Reduce rice/pasta/white bread.

    I shall look for this on iplayer- sounds like what I’m trying to do, thanks Annette.

    While it is true that many of the starches break down into glucose it isn’t as horrible as the added refined sugar which also breaks down quickly and often is about 50% fructose. That is a simple sugar that can really cause problems. So I don’t think it is fair to claim a baked potato equates to 19 sugar cubes as there will be very little fructose in a baked potato. However a sugar cube is 50% fructose.

    Blood sugar can have complex behavior. For example when I workout hard in the fasted state my blood glucose often goes up into the pre-diabetic range and often it is much lower after eating my breakfast. That isn’t what one would expect as I often have multiple servings of fruit with my oatmeal. However I’m measuring blood glucose which doesn’t monitor the fructose in my blood.

    Well stress and cake sent me into a feeding frenzy. Really starting to think there is something in this sugar increasing hunger thing. I had some today thinking one slice won’t hurt. Having recently avoided bread/cake I wasn’t that fussed, had some to be polite and the rest of the day was looking for snacks…wouldn’t even dare to asses my kcal intake.

    I think a one size doesn’t fit all approach to diet is probably true. I think I’ll be avoiding cake from now on though…

    I am really pleased DG that you have had the experience. It certainly makes you think doesn’t it? Don’t worry about the calories. Now you know what cake can do, try avoiding pasta for a week or so and then have some and see how you feel/what happens.

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