If I am banking those miles then I want sunshine all day and pleasant t shirt weather temperature. I shall go to Sicily, always wanted to go.

I suppose that I average 9 miles on a Saturday, not much on a Sunday and probably 4.5 Mon-Fri. If I had a car then I would drive most places. Well done Chubs on the double assault of the driveway. It will get easier and you will shrink as the weeks tick by. I bet you are smaller if you can find a tape measure.

I had very sore thighs and abs on Monday after my first run on Sunday. On Monday I ran better than Sunday and my legs were less sore and then on Tuesday the run itself was easier and my legs were less sore today. I know that next week will be easier as well.

After so much rain, I suspect my garden will be wet for months. More rain all day tomorrow….

Maybe try swimming or water aerobics? Non weight bearing exercise to take the stress off your knee

If you keep putting pressure on your knee you will make it worse and even harder to exercise, I know its frustrating but you need to look after major joints

I think that it would be best to avoid any weight bearing exercise until it is better. You have to walk, so just do that for what you need to do and recalculate your TDEE. Why not have a look on the internet for armchair exercises?

Try putting either hot water bottle or a bag of peas on your knee to reduce the swelling. You could alternate them and see what works best.

Dear Jade- So very sorry for your family’s pain. I know it’s worse for the long happy life together but I hope it begins to fade and the memories will become happy again. They’ll be with you forever!

(((HUGS))) to all who are hurting this week.

Thanks girls, yes my daughter put it well, we tend to think they’ll stick around forever, the older they get. My MIL already had white hair when I first met her decades ago, so she was rather timeless to me. I’m being super sweet to hubs as I know grief takes a few stages – we’re now in kind of a lull after all the family has spread out again. Good to have fluffy puppies at the ready to pitch in with some TLC.

It’s weird how the success of 5:2 does taper off, Annette. I mean, sure there is an explanation with TDEE, but strange how it all just worked without as much effort up to a certain point. I have fallen back into the flames of sugar hell, I’m afraid. I don’t like the hold it has over me so I guess it is back to cold turkey. Gee I’m a hard case, as soon as I wrote that I thought, hmmm turkey, sounds good. Ha. on a nice big baguette. NOOOOoooo. Bad lizard. Stop it.

Sticking to whole foods isn’t hard at all, just requires some planning. This past week hasn’t lent itself to much planning, so I believe I’ll pack up the puppies for some errands and hit the fruit and veggie stand. Aka the grocery store in our small town, although soon enough we’ll have the local produce vendors and with any luck some produce from my own garden. Gotta dig up the compost and mix it with the soil like a real farmer 🐓😎

Let’s kick this can down the road, islanders, whatever is getting in our way. Just takes some prep and good old fashioned brain muscles🗣👊 💪 — have a great weekend all — jade xx

While I’m something of a cave-dweller at the moment I do still read of your efforts and activities and cheer you on from the side-lines.

I, too, am sorry Jade to hear about your Mother-in-law passing away and send lots of strength to you as you support your husband. Mothers are so special and it sounds like she was a very good lady and a loved mother/grandmother. Take good care of yourself.

Annette, I’m sorry it’s such hard going at the moment and while I know that you know the answer, “just because it’s simple don’t mean it’s easy” isn’t an Island catch-cry for nothing. I also had pretty much all my success in the first 8 months but then the honeymoon ended and it’s been the same 10lbs on again and off again for months and months… Right now my new motto is “I don’t do that anymore” and by ‘that’ I mean non-hungry eating. So I’ve decided there will be no discussion, no negotiation, no ‘just this little bit’ but a total blanket application of ‘I don’t do that anymore’ and moving on… I don’t hold out any great hope of success but it is today’s plan and one must have a plan, right????

Chubs, I hope you’re finding something you can do exercise-wise to keep up the momentum without damaging that knee? I swim because my knees are cactus but that is not an option for you it seems. I know that cycling can be prescribed for some knee issues, especially if the knee is well strapped/supported to avoid any injury so perhaps that could be the trick, although the terrain for cycling looks challenging to say the least :-0

Okay, well I’m having a semi-FD today (800cals) and will do the same tomorrow so I can enjoy brunch with my daughter who is visiting from interstate. Love to you all, Spring xx

I sure don’t have the answer to our dilemma. Just that sweets are my downfall. I admire you Annette for so diligently seeking the answer by weighing and measuring. I’m not in the right mood for diligence at the moment. It occurred to me that this past week was one of the few times in the last year I have not given thought to diet. It was nice to relax. That said, I don’t have any delusions of normalcy lol, I’m sure the scale would tell me all about it if I cared to dig it out of the closet, which I don’t. I just want this to stop being so much mental work. Hmmm, Spring maybe I’ll try “I don’t do that anymore” in hopes that saying it will allow me to actually move past thinking about it. And the “it” in my case is those darn simple carbs. Worth a try!! So with plain yogurt, bananas, and grapes, I’m impersonating a health nut so far today 😎 No worries about the GS cookies as they are all (urp!) gone 🙄 Onwards we go, islanders, because why not. 💪💪 jade xx

Hi there! I’ve been AWOL while I was on an eating binge. Too tedious to go through and I have no wish to relive any of it. It certainly wasn’t the kind of genuine tragedy poor Jade has had to deal with. What it was was stress coming at me from every direction and I did what I’ve always done: I ate. And ate. And ate.

By the time my FDs came I was *grateful* for them! I got through yesterday and through lunch today. Lunchtime is my toughest time. I feel ready to complete the day and I feel better and “cleaner” already with an empty gut. I’ve got my appropriate food day foods on hand for tomorrow and I’m planning to use up some salmon in a salmon chowder with oysters and shrimp that I’m really looking forward to for dinner.

I feel for you guys still struggling with sugar. I know my answer is just not to have it. Have you considered trying one week without it to see what that would be like? I know if I had done the kind of binging I did in the past week and let sugar be a part of it I’d never be telling you about any of it. I’d be continuing to binge and not even recognizing the day that I threw in the towel and gave up entirely.

You know best, of course, what rewards you’re entitled to and how you want to do your IFing. I respect that completely. I just hear that you sound sorta distressed by it. …if I’m not misunderstanding your basic garden-variety kvetching. 😏

PS Ever heard of an atmospheric river? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_river We’re smack dab in one. I’m not talking about the first 2 or 3 weeks of rain we’ve had up here. I’m talking about the last few days that have been monsoon-like. Seriously! No exaggeration. The wiki article says that they can dump the equivalent of the volume of the Amazon River and that’s what’s happening.

Lake Shasta south of us in Northern California is California’s largest reservoir. It has been approaching empty over the last 4 years and now they’re projecting that it could fill by the end of the month. Here’s a pic of it last year http://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/photo/2014/09/dramatic-photos-of-californias-historic-drought/c01_53834006/main_1200.jpg and here’s the article that says it could fill up and need to have water released by the end of the month. http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Lake-Shasta-fill-up-El-Nino-full-capacity-drought-6879810.php Astounding!

Chubs- it looks amazing. I hope that the post binge days are getting easier. Sugar was always going to be my nemesis and I am better without it, but ice cream is my favourite and such a struggle to avoid now that there is a little bit of sun. Provided I don’t buy it, then I can’t have it, so I usually avoid that aisle completely. I am working on what makes me buy the ice cream/pain chocolat/chocolate when most of the time I can hold my head high with a ‘I don’t do that anymore’ attitude and walk past it all without a back ward glance. A work in progress. I offered out the remaining 3 ice creams, 2 were taken, 1 rejected…so I had to eat it just to get rid of it! Ho hum.

My very slender friend doesn’t seem to give food any thought at all. She doesn’t enjoy cooking or baking and simply eats to stay alive. Her whole family is slim and always have been. I imagine that all of the years of over eating have become a habit. Changing that habit is always going to be hard, but then anything worth doing is hard.

I find it really interesting what we do that works for us, and I try those strategies out. I am sure that there will be less of us by the end of the year and some of our habits will have altered to accommodate those changes. I never thought it possible to give up sugar in my tea after 40+ years but there was 1 week of misery and several more whinging…but I don’t think of it anymore.

My plan for this week is a small walk/run x3 times and a longer run x1. No fasting, just keeping to the 1200 calories is going to be tough enough or a complete breeze.
My mantra borrowed from AA is ‘one day at a time’.

I had a skinny friend like that in high school, annette. She used to say things that were totally *bizarre* to me given that I *lived* for food. She’d say, “maybe I wouldn’t mind having to eat food if it smelled like perfume. Wouldn’t that be good?”😵 No! If it smells like a cinnamon bun or a grilled steak I’m just FINE with that!

Again, please understand that I respect your choices but it’s my personal belief that there’s far more than habit involved in these things we do. I know there’s a serious degree of nobility in wanting to take responsibility for our choices. Our *character*. But I think there’s far more biology than we suspect or may want to acknowledge. I think when you (editorial “you” there, not aimed an you, annette, or any individual) eat certain things you nourish a certain kind of flora in your gut. And that flora *demands* to be provided with those things that are beneficial for it but not necessarily for us. That is to say craving may be more than a matter of conditioning and stimulus and our caving to it may be more than personal weakness of will.

I can’t overemphasize the difference in my eating habits and my *preferences* since I started fasting! It’s been a pattern over my life when I’ve fasted. And I did a good bit before I discovered IF. I’d just “binge” on *not* eating until I couldn’t do it anymore than then I’d resume binging on the nasty stuff. Now, in a controlled program where I cyclically fast and eat, and where I abstain completely from sugar and the starchy carbs, I can sustain the benefits I get from fasting and, I believe, populate my gut with the flora that have the same interest in high quality nutrition that benefits *me*. It’s a bonus that I’m burning fat and enjoying those foods and the opportunity to have the pleasure of eating.

I don’t want any perfume on my food but a lot more often these days I can behave like my friend and eat to be healthy. …and then, of course, there are those times when eat half a pound of nuts or eat my stress. ::shrug:: But a fast puts a period on those adventures.

So that’s why I *ask* if a sugar free week might be worth the experiment. You are the captain of your ship and you are entitled to the pleasures and practicalities that your life warrants but you could always decide after a week what is and isn’t worth it to you. I just want you to be happy, successful balancing all that out and not having regret about what you choose.

That’s said. I don’t think I’ll ever need to bring it up again. 😉

Bingeingqueen, I’m not sure if we’ve actually “met” yet. But I’m sooooooo empathetic as that’s exactly where I was all of last week. Eating and eating and eating stress. And everything else not solid mineral.

What saved me was my fast. Mine is arranged as back-to-back days and I do complete fasts with only water and naked tea. It cleans me out and re-sets my appetite so that I can stick to sensible guidelines when I do eat.

Because of massive overeating last week there was more white knuckling to the fasting this weekend. I had to keep myself busy and distracted but I got through the hunger of that first lunchtime. That’s my hardest time. And I’ll admit I went to bed pretty early last night to sleep through my final challenge.

This morning I woke up with nothing more than typical light hunger. I’ll have lunch at 2pm. I think I’ll make it just fine as I’ve planned the distraction of a long drive down to Washington and some Stateside shopping. I’m taking my planned lunch with me.

I know it’s intimidating if you’ve never done it but a nice long total fast really is very helpful and empowering to me. After I’ve done it all the white knuckling is over and I can make good choices without much resistance.

This, of course, DOESN’T make the stress go away. We all know that! But it doesn’t add a sense of helplessness and regret to the stress. And that’s good!

Meanwhile, are you taking any nutritional supplements? This might be a good time for a multivitamin and perhaps some B complex to come to your aid in resisting the stress in your life.

Wishing you well and hanging in there with you!

PPS

Are you eating enough good food? When we are dealing with stress, are metabolic needs increase. Our bodies are going through a lot

Don’t undermine yourself by maintaining hunger by not eating enough sensible stuff.

It’s a time to be good to yourself

Queen,
It doesn’t matter one jot what other people do or how much stress they have in comparison to yours. It is your stress and how you feel. The only thing that matters is your reaction and then what you do.

I always thought that food helped in times of stress, but the only thing that happened was that I stayed on that flipping sugar roundabout always looking for my next fix…and I didn’t even know that I was hooked or an addict…I thought that I was normal. Apparently not!

It might be worth a shot at the suggestions from chubs. After all, what have you got to lose? What might you gain?

Have you thought about a different job?
Something calmer?

Bingingqueen, did you know when I first found this forum it was one of your posts on this thread that made me feel like I had found the right place and I was “home”?

Yes, I understand the feeling that you could overeat on cabbage. I once did it on cauliflower and bloated until I thought my stomach would *explode*. We have a biological condition that we have to work around. We need *strategies* and a “road map” to help us navigate our way past it.

Here are my strategies in case they’re of help to you:

• a 2-day water fast (or as close to it as I can possibly get on some days) to tame my appetites
• a probiotic supplement to maintain a healthy gut flora
• a multivitamin to make sure less food doesn’t leave holes in my daily requirements
• complete avoidance of my trigger foods; for me that’s sugar and grains and there are other foods I eat sparingly or only occasionally
• tons of water every day; I like sparkling or carbonated water; makes me feel like it’s more “something”
• something special on my last meal of the week; it gives me something to look forward to and keeps the week lively
• save anything that could be problematical for that last meal so that, if it sets up any cravings, I have a 2-day fast to smack them down
• get enough sleep
• do some moving
• a VERY large salad with beans for protein and steamed veggies as well as greens every lunch; makes me feel full and satisfied and not deprived
• 2 meals a day; I chose sensible food and eat until I’m satisfied
• homemade foods that avoid all the processed foods and non food additives possible. I’m not making my own mayonnaise but I’m cooking my own dried beans, for example

That’s what works for me.

One thing that I wonder about is that protein bar you start your day with. Check and see how much sugar is in it. Typical American ones have as much if not more sugar than a candy bar. Don’t know about the ones you buy but I’d definitely check it out. If that starts your day out with cravings and then you add stress you may be fighting a losing battle. Could you try a hard boiled egg instead for a week and see how that goes?

The miracle of this eating program for me is that it has *decimated* my cravings. That’s *why* I am able to do it. I’d like to see that if you’re dealing with all that stress at work, you’re not adding to that by feeding your cravings instead of your healthy body.

Don’t hesitate to call on me if I can be of any assistance or support. And ignore everything I say that’s not constructive for you. I’m not intending to be judgmental or dogmatic in any way nor do I think I have the key to anything but me. …and that I’m still working on at 68. Plus, I spent the entire week last week eating my stress too! 😉

Sorry to be late chiming in, but Queen I agree with everything you’ve all said. Food does calm us down, even (especially) eating the trigger foods. It’s an addictive response, and true there is not the same kind of destruction as for those battling drug/alcohol addiction, but there is the same kind of pull.

I know exactly what everyone means by “in the moment” – once there, it doesn’t matter what goals and plans were made. It is a feeling of worthlessness or helplessness that allows us to toss the plans aside. And then this ridiculous feeling of calm, which is deceptive. It SEEMS like a good thing, but it’s not. It’s as Annette and Chubs both describe, just body chemistry reacting in the way the food industry knows it will react – wanting more. Our friends who eat just to live? They don’t have that. Maybe they’re impervious, but most people are not; they have no idea why they crave sugar. We do. As a result, perhaps it feels as though you can binge on anything, Queen, but I’ll bet you reach for the simple carbs/sugar when the feeling comes on.

The ONLY cure for it is to avoid the triggers completely. I’m pretty sure your trigger is sugar as it is mine. Surely it’s not cabbage 🙂 But to have that protein bar, which is full of sugar, unless by protein bar you mean a steak 🙂 – just keeps the cycle going. They’re pretty tasty, I know all too well, but all that sugary stuff is my downfall.

Chubs, excellent list – I’m convinced that fasting is the way to reset things, and avoiding sugar/simple carbs is necessary to kick this dependence. I’ve had a rough time with “the moment” lately, but this was an allstar pep talk. No one’s stress is yours, Queen, as Annette said. It doesn’t matter at all what they’re feeling, because that’s not what you feel, and your body chemistry is a huge part of how we feel. We’re tired, or achy, or have a cold, or whatever, and we aren’t the happy people we know we can be.

Today is a FD for me. I need to get back on the wagon myself, but I’ve tried lately at least to avoid the sugar. It is a weird compulsion! I need to go back and read all the posts carefully, there is so much good here, thank you all 🙂 🙂 jade xxx

comespring, I’m sensitive to what you’re saying about how hard triggers can be to identify and how their ability to morph or hide behind other things can be. I know I have a good number of allergies and have had the skin testing but my allergist has explained that pinpointing food allergies is next to impossible to do reliably because a lot can depend on the interaction of combined foods. Meanwhile, the permutations of all the things that can be combined is astronomical.

Perhaps I’m a lucky girl to have such clear reactions to specific foods (that I LOVE). I didn’t used to think so but I may have been very, very wrong. I know for sure that I’m a lucky girl to be several years down the road of abstaining from them. It’s made IF soooooo much easier and more effective.

Welcome back, Penguin!! Soon to graduate, how exciting 🎓🎓 We saved a cave just for you 😎

As you can see, lots of the same struggles going on here, with a bit too much sugar esp the chocolate kind in my cave 🙄 Tried many times to tell myself that a bit of this or that wouldn’t hurt – and as you said Spring sometimes it doesn’t have any bad effect and so I pitch my tent on Planet I am Normal and then BOOM it’s like the scene in The Martian where they all blast off and leave him behind. And I’m like oh hell, I’m actually on Mars?? pass the chocolates then.

Even if there is no sure answer (re the gut microbiome or body chemistry or stress), I’m going to kick this sugar habit once again. I felt better last fall, even though it took some wild nights with grapes and peanut butter to do it. I actually have pulled off a real FD today, having just miso soup and some yogurt. I feel different – calm. I’ve had way too many “FDs” that were regular meals, just smaller. Not sure if there’s anything TO that, but I’m not tempted to have more miso soup, I can assure you. But I also don’t want any sugar. Would love for that to continue! And why not, this stuff has been scientifically proven so might as well give it my best shot. Let’s keep going with this, intrepid islanders 💪👊😍 jade xx

Thank you both for the warm welcome back. It feels good to be here. It also feels good to have successfully fasted today; I had a carrot-ginger soup and a hunk of cheese and now I’m off to bed. Jade, I agree that the sugar thing is a REAL thing, and I kept you in mind today when making choices about what to eat. I know carrots have a lot of sugar in them and the soup has some orange juice in it, too, but no refined sugars. In the past I would have a big bowl of oatmeal on fast days but I’m trying to kick the carb habit. I still like them, and want them to be a part of my life, but I definitely have cravings and those I could do without. I didn’t have any creamer in my coffee, either. And cheese, well, is cheese, and it wasn’t too much. I’m proud of myself and I’m glad to be feeling that feeling again 🙂

Naturally I turn over this not-so-new leaf and WHAT do we have at this banquet breakfast…not the previous bacon, eggs, fruit and pastry (easy to skip), but sweetened yogurt, scones, orange juice, and canned/fresh fruit. Darn it! I didn’t gobble the whole thing, but did eat a bite of yogurt, the fruit, and the scone. It was small-ish 🙂

So now instead of “I don’t do that anymore” my day’s mantra is “I don’t have to keep eating like that.” And I won’t. I swear I cannot hear the candy bowl; I have a mental suit of armor on.

Penguin, go YOU doing a true FD. Doesn’t it feel great?? It has seriously been some time for me, if I’m being honest. I wouldn’t worry about the carrots, so much good in them. And cheese! If I remember my glycemic science right, cheese is going to blunt the glycemic effect, if there is one. I wouldn’t call it an antidote for skittles but until some fruit or veggie outright proves to me it is wrecking my appetite, they’re all welcome in my new clean world.

It’s funny, Annette, I have the same pull from bread, yet yesterday when I had none, I couldn’t have cared less. I felt rather like Chubs, sipping on miso soup and more soup, watering it down to keep it going – my “loaves and fishes” version of soup (no, no actual loaves or fishes). Now, maybe that was just yesterday when I was on Planet Somewhere Not Insane, but there’s a lesson in there. With any luck I’ll figure out what it is 🙂 🙂 😀 xx

Here’s an interesting article that asks what would happen if food nutrition labels expressed the number of calories as equivalent activities that use up those calories. In one Baltimore neighborhood it actually changed people’s choices about juice and soft drinks.

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/10/forget-calories-ii/381494/

And here’s another article that says that the fiber in natural fruit ensures that our bodies metabolize them without the glycemic spikes.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/02/10/ask-well-the-sugar-in-fruit/?ref=health&_r=1

Chubs, right back at you, babe – you fit in perfectly here and I always enjoy reading what you are up to.

Hmm, I don’t know what I’d do with the “how long to burn off” info. My logical brain disappears when I’m in a “sugar moment” – I hate to say I don’t think I would even care how many miles of jogging it would take. Except (like the nutrition info) to keep me from BUYING IT in the first place. Like those old Lean Cuisines, I mean they’re lower in calories and all, but such a paltry amount of pitiful looking food, and not nearly as satisfying as fresh anything. I’d swap miso soup and yogurt for half the calories ANY day.

So, Annette – I’m with you again on Dr. Lustig, though I’m having to ease my way back slowly toward a lower sugar intake. Like last night, we had burgers for dinner (regular god-awful bun) but also no-sugar slaw, oven-baked sweet potato fries, and a handful of grapes. Later, a diet coke with a bit of cream. I know, I know, not the best stuff – but slow and steady is going to work. Yesterday was actually a victory torn from the jaws of defeat after being confronted with nothing but pastries for the long, early breakfast I had to attend!!

But I’m pleased to think this is THE key for me. I’m calmer. I now think of the pure-sugar hit as something that makes me feel bad, like dairy, so my emotional response is different. The white bread last night, while not great nutritionally, didn’t trigger anything, perhaps dented by all the protein and good veggies/fruit at the same time and also there is something mental with me when it doesn’t taste sweet. But Katie Bar the Door y’all, when I have that actual pure sugar hit. So – new goal, no more pure sugar hits. I mean it! I used to speak of them here with reverence, but I hope that has changed forever. Have a great day all – we can do this together! xx jade xxx

What, me fooling myself about food, Penguin? Oh, you mean that time I said “milk” chocolate was a good source of calcium? Or was it the time I thought Girl Scout peanut butter cookies were a good source of protein. Or my all-time favorite, ketchup is a vegetable! 🍅🍅🍟Ha ha!
Congrats on getting your final project done – will we be calling you Dr. Penguin at some point? I am feeling the lack of sleep today, must stay strong in the face of, well, no food here at all. I guess that makes it easier. I wouldn’t touch the candy bowl w/a 10-foot pole, what with 5 hours left to go in my workday. Happy that maybe I have learned my lesson finally. xxx

Penquin, I’m enjoying the image of a little black and white you waddling up to the podium in your hood and tam. Hope it’s a glorious day like yesterday and today. And what a treat to have someone else representing the Pacific Northwest. (I’m in that other Vancouver in BC).

I just love me some steel-cut oatmeal! And I serve it to my husband with homemade roasted applesauce. YUM! But, alas!, it’s one of the things verboten to me. Still, I can remember what it tastes like and enjoy the thought of it. 😏

Happy, too, to think of you on cruise control after years of hard work. What’s next for you? (Said the mom of 3 grads, only 1 of whom is settled in her field…)

annette, I think the calorie equivalence thing is a good idea too. What’s a calorie? If I put a cookie in my mouth and I know it’s 200 calories what does the mean? It’s too abstract a concept to get conversant with. But if I go to the gym and sweat for an hour to burn off 200 calories then I can relate that cookie to something comprehensible and make what has been rendered a truly *informed* choice.

I had 2 excellent days. Not only did I go to the gym and burn some cookies, 😏 but both days when I started thinking I was getting *really* hungry and it was going to be tough to keep a lid on it, I looked up and saw I was past my planned lunchtime.

Another radiant, gorgeous day. My husband’s been out of the country this week and he’ll be getting back late tonight or early tomorrow and the weekend is also supposed to be sunny with those big puffy white clouds. It will be his initial chance to enjoy some sun since we got up here. The vitamin D rush is just a palpable thrill and he’s been working hard and will deserve every bit of it!

PS In LA we call these “Rose Bowl days” because the Rose Bowl parade that everyone watches on TV is always held on these made-for-technicolor days and people think SoCal is really like that all the time. 😂