Hi atcgirl and bennyboy:

Diabetes is not caused by fat in the pancreas. It is caused by insulin resistance. To get rid of that requires periods of caloric restriction combined with eating foods that do not spike the blood sugar, which causes increased insulin and after time insulin resistance. When bypass surgery takes place, people eat much less food which causes a big decrease in insulin production which lessens insulin resistance which reverses the diabetes. That is why almost 90% of bypass patients with diabetes are diabetes free within a couple of months after surgery. The reversal of the diabetes is not caused by the weight loss, it is caused by the elimination of insulin resistance via lower insulin production because the patients are eating so much less food. The weight loss is a ‘side effect’ of the process or treatment.

Dr. Fung and many other doctors have figured out a way to get the same results without surgery by using fasting combined with a high fat, low carb diet. It is working for thousands of people at basically no cost. My 30 Sep 14 post on this thread gives links to two of Dr. Fung’s speeches that outline how it is done – one to patients and the second speech to doctors: https://thefastdiet.co.uk/forums/topic/the-basics-for-newbies-your-questions-answered/

Good Luck!

simcoeluv all your explanations make perfect sense and that was all my original understanding of how type 2 works.

But it’s hard to ignore the fact that all these obese people either had type 2 or they didn’t and those who did had the fatty pancreas. Then the fat decreased in those with type 2, whereas there was no change in the non diabetics.

This study did have a very small group though and I don’t know much about medical studies, but wonder if these results can actually be statistically significant enough to draw conclusions from.

Are you suggesting that the fatty pancreas might actually be a side effect then and not have any effect on insulin secretion?

Hi atc girl:

A result of too much insulin is increased fat deposits (weight gain). Reductions in insulin levels decreases fat deposits (weight loss). It is hard to decrease fat without decreased insulin levels – just ask any diabetic on insulin who gains weight in the face of their doctor’s advice to lose weight. The insulin therapy they are prescribed maintains constantly high levels of insulin in the blood and makes it almost impossible to lose weight. So yes, I believe research shows that the fatty pancreas is a side effect of too much insulin, and that the pancreas loses its fat as insulin secretion decreases as a result of a diet that reduces insulin levels in the body, with accompanying fat loss – including fat in the pancreas.

Research with people that have had stomach reduction surgery shows that they reverse their diabetes long before they lose a lot of weight. Most were morbidly obese before their surgery, and shortly after their surgery they no longer had diabetes even though they were still classified as obese. It is hard to believe that their fat loss came first from pancreatic fat and that is why they reversed their diabetes even though they were still obese. These studies make it clear to me that it is the reduction in insulin levels that reverse the diabetes, not the reduction in weight, which is a side effect of the reduction in insulin levels.

bennyboy: I read the link you posted and found no new or groundbreaking information. If you think about what they did – put people on a low calorie diet that maintains low and does not raise insulin levels – you will understand they ‘discovered’ a method to reverse diabetes that has been utilized since the 1970s. However, mainstream medicine has refused to acknowledge what Dr. Goldhamer has been doing and Dr. Atkins did for decades, and, so far, what Dr. Fung is doing by putting the concepts of fasting (Dr. Goldhamer) and low insulin diets (Dr. Atkins) together to achieve faster results. I would really suggest that the researchers you cited are not aware of the true cause of obesity, diabetes, some cancers and heart disease (consistently high insulin levels), and have come to the wrong conclusion that weight loss is the cure. They found the cure – the diet they used – but instead credited weight loss for the beneficial results!

One thing I did notice that is curious in the researcher’s FAQ page was his statements that fat decreased the production if insulin in the pancreas and getting rid of the fat increased the production. That contradicts the theory of insulin resistance – which is diabetes – by suggesting the body is producing too little insulin which is resulting in too high blood sugar. All research I am aware of indicates diabetics suffer from too high insulin levels. The higher insulin levels result from the insulin resistance, requiring the production of more insulin to remove the sugar from the blood. Ultimately, the body generates a resistance to the insulin effects and it is no longer effective. If the real problem is too little insulin, the body should react positively to increased therapeutic insulin, as it does with type 1 diabetics. However, we know that injecting insulin does not cure diabetes, and the disease progresses until many of the other bad things insulin causes start showing up.

I urge you to read the information I offered to you. If you really are interested (as it does not seem you reviewed the information I previously offered), here is a speech Dr. Fung gave to a group of doctors explaining how he reverses diabetes using fasting and a high fat diet. He gave this speech when he embarked on his mission to cure diabetes. Note how the doctors in the audience laughed at his idea, which has so far helped hundreds of patients (he just began using the procedure a couple of years ago – Drs. Atkins and Goldhamer have reported helping thousands of diabetics over the last 40 or so years): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oZ4UqtbB_g

Good Luck!

Hi bennyboy:

You’re welcome.

My main point was that you don’t have to become ‘slim’ before you reverse your diabetes. Many of Dr. Fung’s patients remain obese or overweight after they have reversed their diabetes, just a most stomach surgery patients reverse their diabetes long before they lose much weight.

Dr. Fung’s program is a combination of fasting and a ketogenic diet. You were on the right track with the keto diet, and it works if you do it long enough. However, it takes time. Dr. Fung found by adding fasting the process is speeded up considerably.

A very basic outline of Dr. Fung’s program goes like this. First, he usually has his patient water fast for at least a week. Some have water fasted for as long as three weeks. After that, depending on the severity of the diabetes, he usually has them do alternate day fasting, doing water fasts on diet days and the keto diet on non diet days. The key to the system is to have diet days that bring the insulin level as low as possible and non diet days that do not raise the insulin levels (by cutting carbs, alcohol and beef). Thinking of the word ‘sensitivity’, think of someone that drinks alcohol constantly. They become ‘used to it’, and need to drink more and more to get the effect from the alcohol that they want (building alcohol resistance). But if they stop drinking for awhile, and then have some drinks, they find it takes less alcohol than it did before to get the effect they want (getting alcohol sensitivity). That is the concept behind cutting insulin levels as low as possible for awhile to get rid of insulin resistance and improve insulin sensitivity.

A person can just start with the ADF segment and succeed – it will just take longer. If you want to use 5:2, then try to water fast on your two diet days and go keto on your non diet days. It will take a little longer, but it will work. And you will still lose weight.

You are motivated and have proven you can do the keto diet. If you don’t focus on weight loss, and focus on doing the diet (whichever method you choose), you will succeed. You will lose weight along the way, but you don’t need to obsess about the amount of the weight loss – you can beat your diabetes long before you reach your weight loss goal.

Good Luck!