Hi ping and welcome:

You can do whatever you want, but if you want to do 5:2, then 7 to 7 is not it.

This thread explains how to do 5:2, and answers most questions that come up about it. What you want to do is a standard cut calories every day diet. You will only lose weight doing what you describe if you count your calories each day, and the amount you lose will depend on how many fewer calories than your TDEE you eat on a weekly basis. If you think about what you are asking, you could easily eat over your TDEE each of the two days – before 7 on one day and after 7 the next – and not lose any weight at all, or even gain weight.

You might check the ‘5:2 Calorie Restriction’ link in the main post that started this thread.

Good Luck!

Hi run and welcome:

I have not seen ‘The Truth about Cancer’. Many cancers are dietary based, so I suspect that is covered somewhere in there.

I use 5:2 when I want to lose weight I am down 40 pounds and have maintained that loss for about 10 months now. I’ll be going back on 5:2 in a month or so to lose some more.

Good Luck!

Hi:

The term ‘fat burning mode’ seems to be used fairly often on this site. It is an interesting term. It seems to imply the body has a state in which it burns fat. The term is usually used in the context that it is important that the body get into this fat burning mode in order to lose weight or lose weight more quickly. It is usually used by people that believe that to get into this fat burning mode you must not eat for a period of time – like 16 or 19 or some other period of hours. The implication here is that if you don’t have this period of not eating, you will ‘burn’ little or no fat compared to if you do get into the mode.

In looking at standard diets, you will see there are no required periods of not eating. The DASH Diet, which again this year was voted in the U.S. by the ‘top’ nutritionists as the ‘best’ diet, and which is a perfect example of the low fat diet, has people eating six or more times a day. The Atkins diet allows people to eat as much fat and protein as they want as often as they want. And the Weight Watchers diet allows snacking at any time as long as people stay within their ‘points’. Nevertheless, people following all of these diets will lose weight. And, most of the weight they lose is fat weight. So it seems the body’s ‘fat burning mode’ starts without any defined period of not eating.

I believe at least some of the people that believe in the ‘fat burning mode’ may be confusing the ‘mode’ with the concept of ketosis. Ketosis is a metabolic state where most of the body’s energy supply comes from ketone bodies in the blood generated by the burning of fat, in contrast to a state of glycolysis where blood glucose provides most of the energy. Ketosis basically means the body is mostly running on fat. A body can get ‘into’ ketosis by either fasting, in which case the body is running on its own fat, or eating a high fat moderate protein very low carb diet for a period of time, in which case the body is running on fat from the food being eaten. Science has shown that while the brain, in particular, prefers running on sugar, it actually seems to run as well or better on ketones from fat.

It takes some time for the body to get into a ‘ketosis mode’. Research shows the progression is like this when water fasting, remembering that along the way the body is burning more and more fat (adapting to burning fat) to make up the caloric deficit being experienced by the body and that every body is different so the time frames do not apply exactly to every person. First, the body uses blood sugar generated by the last meal. This takes about six hours. Second, the body starts burning glycogen stores. It takes about 24 to 48 hours to burn through these. Third, the body starts burning protein – muscle. This is because the body has not yet fully switched over to burning fat, and protein is easier for the body to utilize for energy than fat at this point in the cycle. This is not an ideal situation, however, because if the body were to continue burning muscle it would die – because it would eat up the body’s major muscle, the heart. This muscle burning mode can last up to 14 days. Finally, the body gets into ketosis, where a majority of its energy is coming from burning fat. This usually happens within about three days (think 51% of the body’s energy coming from fat). The reason muscle continues to be burned is twofold. First, even though the body has entered ketosis the body is still adapting to burning fat instead of sugar, so is still ramping up its fat burning – for obvious reasons because it does not want to burn more muscle than necessary. It isn’t until about 14 days that the body is getting a very large majority of its energy from fat. Muscle is being burned in the meantime to augment the increasing calories coming from fat. Second, the body cannot live without the nutrients in protein, so it will always burn muscle to get those nutrients, although at a much slower pace than when it first started using muscles for energy. This is why people on diets never see that only fat is burned – they always experience some muscle loss.

This process illustrates several interesting things about diet. It illustrates why a high fat, moderate protein and low carb diet mirrors what the body eats when in its basic survival mode. It is not an unhealthy diet, it is a natural one. It also shows that carbs of any kind are unnecessary for the body to function properly. The body only stores about a two day supply of sugar (carbs), and the reason is to supply quick energy if it is necessary to chase down an animal for food or run from someone or something trying to kill and/or eat it. The longest documented medically supervised water fast lasted for over 54 weeks, and the guy remained healthy for all of that time without eating even one gram of carbs of any kind. He was, however, constantly eating fat and protein. There is nothing wrong with natural carbs, but it is hard to understand why people would base an eating plan on food unnecessary for human health (carbs) and try to cut or eliminate foods which, if not provided, will cause the body to die (fat and protein).

This all shows that the key to burning the most body fat is the restriction of caloric intake, not time between meals. The body just does not burn that much more fat in 16 hours than it does while you are sleeping. There is no reason to go clock watching so you can burn more fat or lose weight more quickly.

The less you eat, the more fat you burn!

P.S. Sorry for the length, but I’m on day 9 of a 10 day water fast and have nothing else to do.

Hi annette:

I’m down 11 pounds in 8 days. Some of course is water weight and loss of ‘food in transit’ which will be quickly regained when I resume eating. The average loss a person can expect is about a pound a day or a little less.

I’m not doing it for weight loss, although that is welcome, but sort of as an experiment. I had a check up recently and my blood pressure, while OK, was higher than I want it to be. Dr. Goldhamer’s research indicated longer water fasts significantly dropped blood pressure levels, so I’m trying it out to see if it will apply to me. It won’t be an apples to apples comparison because his research took blood pressures at the end of the fast, and I won’t be checking mine for another three weeks (I couldn’t do a 10 day fast over Christmas, with all of the dinners and functions I go to). But it will be interesting to see what, if any, changes occur.

Hi:

One of the common questions from newbies is ‘What do I eat on diet days?”

My standard answer is that as long as they stay within the calorie limits of 500/600, they can eat any food they want. I go on to observe that many people find that eating one evening meal that is high in fat and protein works best.

There are a reasons for that answer. First, if you eat any carbs, but especially processed carbs like toast, cereal or any sugar, even sugar in fruit, as most newbies do, you will get hungry. And if you eat them in the morning, you will be hungry all day. What they don’t understand is that not eating anything will actually result in less hunger than eating carbs will. The second reason is that many people have trouble sleeping after their diet days. I have addressed why in my post of 13 Dec 14 on this thread, but in short eating that kind of meal lessens the chance of a sleepless night.

In my ‘Warnings’ thread, I suggest a newbie focus on doing their diet days correctly for at least a month. It takes the body about a month to get used to the radical change in eating pattern that 5:2 requires. And focusing on doing the diet days correctly also hastens the ‘learning process’ that 5:2 brings. By that I mean the seemingly magic change in eating habits that people all over this and other sites report. They pay more attention to what they are eating on non diet days, they change their food choices, often toward eating less sugar and fewer other carbs. They learn that skipping a meal or two is not only OK, but it often makes them feel better, too. (It is amazing how many people believe that missing a meal is not only unhealthy, but actually dangerous!)

Given the above, my next suggestion is sometimes viewed as radical, especially by newbies. I believe that once a person has done four consecutive weeks of proper diet days, their next goal should be to have all of their diet days be water fasts. My experience and observation has been that if you do that, your learning process will speed up even further. And, you will start seeing better weight loss results because you will be cutting an additional 1000/1200 cal. from your diet each week without adding another diet day or affecting how much you eat on your non diet days. Finally, water fasting lowers insulin levels in the blood much more than if you just eat ‘less’, and there are long term benefits to lowering insulin levels!

Then you can start playing around with water fasting if you get that far, and if you want to. Two water fasting days in a row are still 5:2. And if you can do that, and are interested in going further, you are gaining experience. Current research shows that doing 4 or 5 day water fasts every one to three months is extremely healthy and beneficial. Such fasts are certainly not for everyone, but if you want to and can do them they seem to provide the ‘other health benefits’ that many people hope they get with 5:2, but which it is unproven they will get with 5:2 at this time.

Good Luck!

Hi Dinah and welcome:

I think many people start something new around the start of a new year. This way of eating will teach you, if you let it, that missing a meal is no big deal. It will also teach you many other things that cannot be easily explained – but become obvious after you do 5:2 correctly for a month or two.

Focus first on doing your two diet days correctly each week – 500 or fewer calories each diet day – and other things will fall into place. Give 5:2 time to work – you cannot judge results after a week or two – or four.

If you read the initial post on this thread, and/or a few of the other links, you will be prepared for what might (will?) happen along your journey. But if you just keep going, next year at this time you will be a very happy person.

Good Luck!

Hi Christine and welcome:

Fasting will cure some auto-immune and other problems. 5:2 is not fasting, but it will introduce you to what it is. Start with 5:2, do some research, keep going with 5:2, and see what happens. You never know unless and until you try.

Good Luck!

Hi all:

Well, the experts in the US have spoken and determined the best diets available. 5:2 is close to the bottom (32 of 38 – tied with the ‘Body Reset’ diet), and barely beating out Atkins, raw food, Paleo and Dukan. I thought the number 21 diet, the ABS diet, was interesting. While the experts have decreed ABS to be much better than 5:2, they took issue with the company’s claim that dieters can drop up to 12 pounds of belly fat in two weeks and questioned the evidence behind some of its tactics.

The US can be ‘expert driven’, and this may explain why 5:2 is not all that popular in the US. Countering that, of course, is the fact the Atkins diet is the most popular diet in the US – so coming in ahead of Atkins may suggest 5:2 has a chance! Anyway, if 5:2 is not your cup of tea, according to the experts here are many better alternatives: http://www.msn.com/en-us/health/weightloss/the-38-best-diets-overall/ss-AAgnZrP?ocid=spartanntp#image=22

Good Luck!

Hi stankaps:

I am aware that long term water fasters sometimes eat a modified diet after their fasts are over. It seems to vary by the faster. Post fast meals often include juice and then fruits and veggies, sometimes a day or two of special eating for each week of fasting.

Your ‘fasts’ are for two days and are not water fasts – you are eating every day. However, if you feel there are potential long term problems because of ‘meal shock’, you should not do what you are doing and should modify it to something you are more comfortable with. Or stop what you are doing altogether.

It is totally up to you.

Good Luck!

Hi Silent:

First, from a 5:2 standpoint, each week you can diet two days in a row, or two non consecutive days. From a time standpoint, you actually diet longer with non consecutive days than you do with consecutive days.

As the post that started this thread indicates, you eat 5/600 cal. or less on your diet days and to your TDEE or less on non diet days. That means that you will not ‘put back the calories on that you lost’. Of course, that really is up to you – if you overeat on your non diet days you will indeed mitigate or erase the caloric reduction caused by the two diet days and lose more slowly or not lose weight at all.

Many people record their calories on gizmos they purchase. I think there is something called My Fitness Pal on line that will help you keep track of the calories you eat. And, of course, there is the old fashioned way of just figuring out how many calories are in the food you are eating, either from books or on line, and writing them on paper. Pretty much all calorie counting is really just estimating, because you will find different sources of calories in foods give different numbers for the same food, and portion sizes make a big difference – like how many calories are in a potato – small, medium or large – and what do small, medium and large mean, anyway? I think many of the electronic calculators make people too sure they are eating whatever the number is that comes up, and that leads to some wrong decisions along the way.

Again, the initial post in this thread explains 5:2. Your 10:30 to 10:30 example is not 5:2. Assuming you ate normally before 10:30 pm I guess it would depend on how much you ate in the subsequent 24 hours and how much you ate after 10:30 pm the following day. If you ate 600 cal. or less in the 24 hour period and then went to bed and did not eat until waking, you would be doing 5:2. But if you ate a large meal after 10:30 you would simply be on an every day reduced calorie diet. I am told that the Fast Diet book gave the 24 hour diet as an alternative if a person couldn’t do 5:2, and some people report it works for them. My observation is that most people that try the 24 hour diet don’t stick with it long and go on to their next new diet.

Every person has their own definition of what ‘eating healthy’ means. My observation is that if a person focuses on doing their diet days correctly, they many times, over time, change the types of foods they are eating to types they personally feel are more healthy for them.

Good Luck!

Hi Sar:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3017674/

I’m curious – why couldn’t you reach the link? Are you unfamiliar with how to navigate in the forum, or did you find it missing?

The headache is a common early complaint, and the cure is in the post that started this thread – page one. Go just below the last post on this page, or just above the first post on the page, see the 1-7, and hit 1. That will get you to the first post. Then you will see the posts are in date order.

Good Luck!