After a year and a half of 5:2 I've been putting on weight over last few months

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Communikate

9:04 am
16 Sep 15
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Help!!! I’ve been consistently doing the 5:2 since February 2014 and very easily lost several kilos. But over the last few months the weight has crept back on and now I’m finding that I’m just not feeling hungry – even on my fast days. It feels like my metabolism has slowed right down and I’m not sure whether I should continue on the 5:2 or not. I’ve only just joined the site and to be honest I’ve never done the whole TDEE thing – just consumed 500 calories on fast days and around 1200 on non fast days. I exercise about 4-5 days a week and have upped it a bit recently but it hasn’t made any difference. Has anyone else experienced this and does anyone have any solution for getting my metabolism back on track? After extolling the program’s virtues to everyone I know, I now feel quite depressed and disheartened by the fact that my clothes aren’t fitting and that I have all this extra padding.

simcoeluv

4:24 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi Communikate and welcome:

There is nothing wrong with your ‘metabolism’.

When you lose weight your TDEE goes down. (This link explains TDEE: https://thefastdiet.co.uk/forums/topic/tdee-for-the-curious-or-why-dont-i-lose-weight-faster/.) You have to eat less to maintain your new, lower weight. As you increase your weight, your TDEE goes up. So you are actually increasing your metabolism as you gain weight – not a worthy goal for someone interested in losing weight!

If you are gaining weight, you are eating over your TDEE. You may not be feeling hungry because you are eating more than you think you are – even on fast days. Of course, those on 5:2 for awhile also report that it takes less food to make them feel full. Exercise is healthy but not effective for weight loss.

I’m afraid if you are gaining weight you will have to start eating less food than you currently are. Computing your TDEE and counting calories for a week or so should show you why you are gaining.

Good Luck!

2onthefastrack

5:18 pm
16 Sep 15
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@simcoeluv, I’m confused then. In his book Dr. Mosley never mentions having to reduce your caloric intake other than to the 500 calories on the fast days. He reiterates several times that you can like he says he did eat a normal amount which she says is 1200 calories. If her metabolism is speeding up it would burn calories more efficiently would it not? Dr. Mosley said he and the study groups continued to lose weight until reaching their goal and then they reduced their fasting day to once a week to maintain, unless, like on holiday, they consumed to much and then would bump it up to twice/wk until back to goal.

It would seem what you are saying is she needs to further reduce her calories. So what happens after 5 years on the plan? In order not to gain weight she would be on a very calorically restricted diet just to keep from gaining wieght? Please don’t misunderstand I am not trying to be sarcastic, I truely am trying to understand what you mean because I have recently started this plan because it seems livable, and has been for a month now. But I was hoping for a continual result as Dr. Mosley wrote about not an eventual further reduction even on non-fast days which isn’t mentioned at all.

Thanks

simcoeluv

5:40 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi 2 and welcome:

TDEE means the number of calories your body needs to neither gain nor lose weight. If you eat more than your TDEE, you gain weight. If you eat less than your TDEE, you lose weight. If you eat at your TDEE, you neither gain nor lose.

There is no way a person can, over time, eat over their TDEE and lose weight, or eat less than their TDEE and gain weight.

People that come to 5:2 to lose weight obviously have been over eating – eating over their TDEE. The only way they can lose weight is to eat less – less than their TDEE.

5:2 causes a calorie deficiency by reducing the number of calories a person eats to 5/600 for two days a week. How much weight a person loses doing this depends on how many calories they eat on the other five days. If they eat around their TDEE on those other days, the average weight loss on 5:2 is about a pound a week. But if they eat over their TDEE on the other five days, they will not lose that much, not lose at all, or gain weight – depending on how many calories over their TDEE they are eating on those five days. If they eat less than their TDEE on the other five days, they will lose weight faster, perhaps a pound and a half a week. The TDEE link I posted explains ‘the numbers’.

One of the very hard things anyone on a diet has to learn is how little food their bodies need to maintain their ‘ideal’ weight. To get an idea, work out your TDEE for your goal weight. That will be the approximate number of calories you will be ‘restricted to’, on average, to maintain that weight.

What often happens on 5:2 is people lose weight, stop being so ‘strict’, and stop losing and start gaining. The only way to reverse the weight gain is to eat less.

There are two ways to look at it – the less you eat, the more you lose, or the more you eat, the less you lose. There is nothing that Dr. M might imply that changes this basic rule

Good Luck!

Amazon

5:49 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi kate, can I suggest a couple of things.
First of all click the how it works link at the top of the page and work out what your TDEE should be for your goal weight, bearing in mind that most of us over estimate how much exercise we do. Once you’ve done that try a few weeks on 5:2 and eat no more than your TDEE on non fast days. I would also suggest weighing and measuring everything every day for two weeks.

There is a common myth that “metabolism” slows down if you diet. Your metabolic rate is the amount of calories your body needs on a daily basis and the more you weigh, the higher the calories needed for you to function. To put it very simply, the less someone weighs (and the more sedentary their lifestyle) the less they need to eat.

I have lost 5 stone and have been re-calculating my TDEE after every 7lbs. I am now using my goal weight TDEE, a tip I picked up from someone on maintenance. This means that when I reach my goal, I won’t have to make any more adjustments and will hopefully make maintenance easier.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Ceedub

6:07 pm
16 Sep 15
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1200 calories isn’t very much. I don’t see how she can reduce her calories more.

Maybe your excersize is making you gain. Your working out 5 days a week? Just my opinion when I used to walk too much I would gain.

milena

6:24 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi
well written Amazon.

I’m in the same boat – except I’m slightly deeper in the water, need to lose about 6 stone to get to a healthy BMI of 22 – which would give me a bit of wiggle room, at 59, being short and not very active, my TDEE will be 1289.

I agree 1200 is not much, a distance from the ‘average’ of 2000 for a woman, but if its all I’m going to need, better get used to the idea.

Obviously eating ‘normal’ for me put the weight on, there may be a myriad of other reasons for many of us, but how many can say they have always eaten just 1200 – 1300 calories a day and still put on weight?

And I’m nearly 5’3″, if you are shorter than that, it could well be under 1200.

On the bright side, unless you are logging faithfully EVERY mouthful, every drink and all ingredients, 1200 is such a low number, it would be easy to mis-calculate. I miscalculate nearly every day.

Wasn’t Michael just a few pounds overweight, Mimi I think went from a BMI of 22 to 19. Two people who have matured without ever being obese are not to be compared to people who are using this WOL to shed stones after years of putting on those stones.

So when Michael suggests eating normally on the non-fast days – his normal, I suspect is not the same ‘normal’ as some of the folks on here.

2onthefastrack

7:57 pm
16 Sep 15
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Thanks Simcoeluv, I have in fact read the referred to article and it makes perfect sense. We are losing as of now. But my husband’s bs is not responding as we were hoping so I am now off to try to research why. Thanks again.

Amazon

7:57 pm
16 Sep 15
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It is impossible to gain weight by exercising. The only way a healthy person gains weight ie fat cells is by eating a higher number of calories than the body needs.

simcoeluv

8:16 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi 2:

What do you mean by ‘bs’? Blood sugar?

2onthefastrack

8:29 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi simcoeluv, Yes blood sugar, I have seen the UK and Australia use a different system of measurement. But by US measures, my husband is “prediabetic” He needed to lose about 40lbs and has lost 17lbs. His A1C last visit was 5.9 with a fasting glucose of 115. His last triclycerides were 197. His doctor tried to put himm on Actos, but after my research we said no and that is what led us to this plan. However his bs looks fine after a fast day sometimes as low as 77. But after a normal day (which is normally on the lower carb side) it still fluctuates between the 90s and lower 100s. Not what we were hoping for. Not helping that friends with not well controlled diabetes tells him those are great numbers. I was looking on the boards to see if anyone else had a similar experience or tip. Btw he runs about 2 mls about 3 days a week.

Amazon

8:32 pm
16 Sep 15
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Have you looked at this thread 2?

https://thefastdiet.co.uk/forums/topic/reversing-type-2-diabetes-the-fastday-lifestyle/

2onthefastrack

8:45 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi Amazon, I just looked at it and I’ll admit I have a hard time reading the poster’s comment. But we have in the past done a pretty restrictive low carb diet in which turned out to be not sustainable. We were told by the doctor no whites, only whole grains etc. He cut out all sodas, candy sweets. He lost weight at first then it leveled off and then he started gaining even though he has not changed his new eating habits. This plan seemed to offer hope of better compliance (i.e.staying on it) and that is exactly what is happening and he is losing weight but the bs is not responding the way we had hoped.

Amazon

9:08 pm
16 Sep 15
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If you look in the medical conditions section of the forum there are several threads about diabetes, and I know that many diabetics have benefitted and even reversed their diabetes with 5:2.

I would suggest not worrying too much about what your husband’s blood results are until he has lost 40lbs and really healthy eating habits have become second nature. He isn’t diabetic and there is no reason to believe that will change if he loses weight and eats healthily.

Low carb is very difficult for anyone to sustain, but cutting out as many processed carbs as possible is much easier.

2onthefastrack

9:23 pm
16 Sep 15
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@amazon, That is some of what I was wondering if we needed to wait until he has lost the full 40lbs. The 5:2 is working well as we both have lost weight and have found we are not starving on our fast days and have even found we are not as hungry on our off days. He is not diabetic true, five years ago his A1C was 6.3 it is now 5.9 but his doctor has already tried twice to put him on meds. And was greatly annoyed when we declined. So we are being very proactive to avoid this, it does not run in his family and we want to keep it that way. I agree, I truly believe a lot of what is wrong with our diets today is processed food and we have jumped off that band wagon quite a while ago. Thanks for your comments

simcoeluv

9:38 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi 2:

My 30 Sep 14 post on this thread (its on page 2): https://thefastdiet.co.uk/forums/topic/the-basics-for-newbies-your-questions-answered/, gives some links to some basic information that might be helpful.

Type 2 is often caused by eating a low fat, high carb diet. The only way to reverse the progression is to seriously reduce carb intake, especially processed carbs.

As you have discovered, fasting does this – but only temporarily. A single fast cannot overcome eating processed carbs the next day (or hour).

5:2 will not, by itself, reverse diabetes or pre diabetes. It must be accompanied by a change of diet. The person has to start eating a high fat, moderate protein, very low carb diet. This is often difficult to do because carbs are addictive and someone who has developed diabetes or is pre diabetic is often addicted to the food that is causing the disease. That is one of the main reasons people find it hard to ‘stick to’ and Atkins type diet – they were told for decades to eat high carbs, they did, and became addicted.

Dr. Atkins realized this over 40 years ago and incorporated as part of the Atkins diet a two week ‘Induction Phase’ that was designed to help break the addiction to carbs. A person has to eat 20 grams or fewer of carbs a day for two weeks, although clinical testing has shown people can eat that few carbs for months with no adverse effects (and many positive ones). After that phase was over, people had to really work not to let carbs slip back into their diets – because if they did, the addiction took over and soon they were eating like they used to eat.

So, sad to say, if your husband wants to control his blood sugar, he must change his diet. 5:2 will cause the weight loss and help with insulin resistance, but I’m afraid he must also continuously eat a low carb diet to ultimately be successful.

Good Luck!

2onthefastrack

10:13 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi Simcoeluv, Yes over the years we have come to that. In 1990 he was told his cholesterol was high he was put on a statin and given the heart healthy diet. I was an LPN and in those days it was believed a heart healthy diet was low fat. We were so wrong. We tried Atkins in early 2000s, not a good result, total rebellion on all fronts (husband kids not sustainable). Then the whole “whole grain” thing. Again not good. We are back to the low carb, more of a meat and vegetables type diet with little bread or pasta, (think Grain Brain/Wheat Belly) which has somehow been more easy to follow. So far. He is off his BP meds. and he has not taken his cholesterol meds for close to a year. If we can get his bs under control I will be ecstatic. He doesn’t fall off this wagon as often but I do have to be creative. I will look up that link, thanks for your comment.

simcoeluv

10:39 pm
16 Sep 15
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Hi 2:

As you are probably aware, weight gain does not cause diabetes (it is a symptom) and weight loss does not cure it. If the current diet is not yielding the results you are after, and it cannot be changed, then . . . . maybe you can hope things will improve.

Good Luck!

2onthefastrack

10:40 pm
16 Sep 15
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BTW Simcoeluv- I have seen the video by Dr. Jason Fung about a month ago very good information. In fact it was what confirmed our choice to do the 5:2. Thanks again for the tips and leads.

bayleafoz

1:20 am
17 Sep 15
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Hi there

From personal experience I want to endorse all that Simco and Amazon have written. I lost 17 kg in six months and it stayed off for a year. I ate no processed carbs during the time of losing weight. I went alcohol free for 3 days a week. I limited my “treats” to 1-2 a week. I paid attention to my TDEE.

Lately I have been slack in my attention to fasting days and non fasting days, allowing myself a sugar carb treat on every non fast day. Ouch! And not counting exact calories on fast days. Double ouch!

That has stopped as of last week. I am now paying strict attention to my TDEE and to my type of food intake.

As a direct result of my complacency, I have gained weight. Now I’m back on low carb, normal fats and moderate protein intake. I have also reduced my calories on my fast days to under 400. I believe what Simco has written, that the body has to reduce its total calorie intake. As you reduce in weight, you need less food to power yourself. I have way more energy the less I eat in total.

No wheat, no sugar is my ideal diet, so I regularly put myself on a sugar free challenge. This way of life 5:2 suits my all or nothing personality. 🙂

Good luck. Cheers, Bay 🙂

Communikate

1:38 am
17 Sep 15
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Hello all – thanks for the responses – I was obviously asleep in southern hemisphere time when most of them came through. My TDEE came up as 1835 calories. I certainly haven’t been eating that much on my non-fast days…but maybe I should be? Am confused and maths is by no means my strongest subject. However it is possible I might have lost the same vigilance that I started with, but that was because I had gotten to a place where I was super happy with my weight and was able to easily maintain if for months. I’m 1.6 metres and my weight was down to 55-54kgs – I’m now creeping up to 60kgs.

After doing some research, I’m actually thinking that the main culprit in my weight gain is a hormone called progesterone that I have been taking since March to help me sleep. It works wonders – but it’s counter productive if I’m then losing sleep over gaining weight! My gut feeling is that is what is causing the problem. I will take on the advice re having to eat less… however given my weight loss was only between 5-7kgs I’m not sure that would make such a difference?

Anyway, am really appreciating the advice and feel a bit more hopeful in the program that had been working so beautifully for me!

Ceedub

3:42 am
17 Sep 15
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No offense but you can gain weight working out too much. I have been true to my calories before in the past and walked a ton and gained 4 pounds in week. So it can happen.

Amazon

8:29 am
17 Sep 15
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Ceedub, there is a common misunderstanding regarding weight gain and gaining fat, which is why I specified gaining fat in my previous post.
It is impossible to gain fat if you do not exceed the number of calories your body needs, and to gain for example, 4lbs in fat you would have to over eat to the tune of 12-15000 calories.
Exercise can cause a temporary rise in the reading on the scales as the body retains water when hard worked muscles are recovering. The scales can fluctuate up and down to the tune of several pounds and it is nothing to do with fat gain or loss. If I weigh every day the numbers can vary over a week as much as 7lbs but it doesn’t mean I’ve gained as it is mostly down to what I’ve been doing and if it is a FD or not.

Mogs

11:16 am
17 Sep 15
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You can put on weight through exercising if you’re building muscle too – but you’ll be a different shape.

Amazon

11:21 am
17 Sep 15
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Hi Mogs, I agree that if you are not calorie restricting and working out in order to strengthen muscle and tone up you might gain a small amount of weight, and if you are body building you will definitely gain, but neither are relevant in this instance.